Phantom 18 ?

[Ian]

I know we've probably had this question before but that was before someone deleted all the previous threads. So...my apologies if anyone is bored with this one but here goes.

Whats best....Phantom 18 or Ring 18

Won't be used for racing.....let's say high speed cruising and ski-ing.

Any particular model years to avoid.

Any other manufacturers to consider.

What about the 21' versions

Thanks

Ian. :seaman:

[Cookee]

I would choose a Phantom every time - although the new shape ones (they changed manufacturer and the deck) I have no knowledge of. I'm sure JF will have something to say about them though!

[Captain Chaos]

...wearing the blue trunks Mr Fuller!

You may or may not know that i've been looking for one of these for god knows how long.

My desperate And lengthy search has led me to the 4 corners of the UK and i've gained some good insight.

Rings are fantastic, but thier builder is a grumpy so & so. Phantoms are brilliant & thier builder put a bit more of himself into them.

Newer phantoms 16&18 are unproven, for a 20/21/23 try Crompton marine in sussex.

For a Ring 16C (17ft) call Mike Vincent @ South Coat Marine, Bournemouth....he's helpfuli: they're not costly and go like stink with a small V6!!. For anything 21ft and over, contact extreme marine on this forum.

So theres my opinion....definately buy a Ring or a Phantom!!!

Oh and if you find any in nice condition, I'll have 2!!!!!!!!


Step-up the rest of you!

[Captain Chaos]

??

sorry, no comprende??

also, i've actually had no time, most of my searching has been done @ 1am with me ass parked in front of this PC !!!

[Captain Chaos]

If i actually buy another boat, what will i have to whinge about?

[Admiral P. Brain]

Biggest Arms has a Ring 16 with 135 mercury for sale
its in excellent condition (i should know its in my garden!!)
and runs superb
think its a late 80's model

[captain morgan]

ARE YOU SURE ROB?

i think it's a phantom

[Admiral P. Brain]

sorry meant to write Phantom !!!
yes it certainly is

cheers

[Admiral P. Brain]

Matt you launched yet ??

[Admiral P. Brain]

why do you need luck ??

[phantomc92]

monday looks ok at the moment. phantom for speed. ring for the rough

[Ian]

Now I'm really confused,

I've seen quite a few Ring 18s for sale, but when you look at Mike Ring's website on the history page, he reckons he never made an 18.

Chaos reckons the 16' is a 17' so have the people advertising 18s over measured a 16 or undermeasured a 20.

[chris]

where are the moulds for the phantoms,thought they were somewhere else, trio mouldings? if it was compton they will go well at hm auctions?

[Jon Fuller]

Originally posted by phantomc92
phantom for speed. ring for the rough

You've clearly never had a 'Happy Hooker' swap ends on ya! an experience every performance boater should have to increase their respect for fine design!:wotzhapni

[phantomc92]

had a few of both,and thats my general feeling of both

[Phantom 19]

They did make a Ring 18, its a lot wider and beefier build than the 16, its more of a cut down 20/21.

Ive also had a 15 (No Worries) which I think is just a bare bones 16 for OCR.

And Mike Ring was very helpful when it came to helping me set up the 15, took the time to fax me details etc

[Jon Fuller]

To me, the only thing more scarey than an out and out, full on stuff, is a horizontally spray railed sports boat pulling an unexpected 180 when you're running at 101% (although by rights, it shouldn't be unexpected) now that really gets your attention :aaahhh:

[BREN]

i have also found mike ring very helpful in the past when i have telephoned him.

[Ian]

Originally posted by jon fuller
To me, the only thing more scarey than an out and out, full on stuff, is a horizontally spray railed sports boat pulling an unexpected 180 when you're running at 101% (although by rights, it shouldn't be unexpected) now that really gets your attention :aaahhh:

Jon,

Was the hooking common to all models or just one or two?

Ian

[Tony Davis]

Originally posted by jon fuller
To me, the only thing more scarey than an out and out, full on stuff, is a horizontally spray railed sports boat pulling an unexpected 180 when you're running at 101% (although by rights, it shouldn't be unexpected) now that really gets your attention :aaahhh:

Especially when the cause of it is your "throttle man" trimming the drive in by mistake!!!

[Jon Fuller]

Steady tiger! we all make mistakes

[Admiral P. Brain]

is that when u lost the hatch !!!

[Jon Fuller]

No, that one was Tony's fault! he caused a massive turbulance by standing in the cockpit at speed, and it tore the hatch off.

[Admiral P. Brain]

i hear the only turbulance at that speed was coming out your shorts !!!

[Jon Fuller]

Mmmm, maybe, as I watched my hatch sink out of site!

[Captain Chaos]

Jon,

i think its really about time you got off the fence and told us what you REALLY think of the imperfections in Mr Rings hull designs!

[Admiral P. Brain]

what about the phantom 16 !!! sweet running boat

[Captain Chaos]

Put quite simply,

I want a decent 19-21ft boat.....no cracked sh!te or hulls that have been fecked to the point of destruction and then tarted up to be flogged!

secondly, whilst money isnt of great issue, I've come to the conclusion that i've not got enough time to look for bloody boats properly, let alone use one! so i'll be looking for something 'worth the money' not @ some dreamers price (coz theres plenty of them).

already contacted c92 whom informs me that its got the 'usual starring' for an '86. I also viewed somethinmg last weekend whilst down at port solent and am pestering the life out of another guy.....but both want silly money @ the moment!!!!


I maintain, if you know of enything else, say £5-9K then let me know.

off my soap box now!

cheers all

CK

[phantomc92]

hum, silly money............. but you havent even seen it,so how can you tell:confused:

[Captain Chaos]

Sorry,:bang:

I wasnt refering to you or your phantom. My poor english must have been misunderstood.

I was talking about the umpteen other boats i've viewed this year and in particular, a boat i saw on sunday. Nice enough, but fella wants £8K i value it @ £5k so it looks like another wast of £45 in juice!!!!!!

i'll be in touch re yours anyway

:up: :up:

CK

[phantomc92]

no worries:up:

[Jon Fuller]

Originally posted by Captain Chaos
Jon,

i think its really about time you got off the fence and told us what you REALLY think of the imperfections in Mr Rings hull designs!

Well to be honest, With the larger rings at least, my opinion is almost exactly the opposite of Pc92, ie, Rings are possibly a little quicker for a given hp, than the Phantom, but the Phantom has superior handling/behaviour when it roughs up.

On the bigger Rings, they have a shallower deadrise along the centre line (between the inner spray rails deadrise is under 20 deg) and a slightly rounded keel line, both of these features make for more speed per hp.

However, their very heavy spray rails FWD, which run fairly horizontal and bold, right to the stem, when presented to the sea ( a wave) a little one sided, try to steer the boat by the bow (bow steer) which can induce a lovely hook, the Phantom design has a far more neutral, and thus forgiving FWD spray rail design (IMHO)

When we raced the 26' Ring designed 'Exreme', we had a considerable top speed advantage over Roger Severy's 28 Phantom, but when it roughed up he was in a different class, this wasn't all down to the hull design, but it was a major part.

As I said, all IMHO!

[phantomc92]

so size does matter.................2ft makes alot of difference

[Captain Chaos]

:up:

bloody hell, a constructive & considered answer on boatmad, i thought they were are layed to rest with the original archive!

cheers Jon, dosent help me find any of the above though!

CK

[Tony Davis]

Originally posted by phantomc92
so size does matter.................2ft makes alot of difference

A second motor helps a little as well!:hugegrin:

[Jon Fuller]

Originally posted by phantomc92
so size does matter.................2ft makes alot of difference

Yes, to a degree the size must have helped, also, as fatty says, twin engines help enormously with roll stability when it chops up and you are constantly in and out of the water, although Rogers Phantom would have been quicker top speed with a single engine, if that engine were say 75% of the combined power of the twins he has.

My point though, is that the shallower deadrise of the larger Rings is the major contributor to their higher performance per HP, but that shallower deadrise, combined with their FWD spray rail design is their achilles heel when it comes to rough water performance, having said that, the FWD design is a very efficient 'anti stuff' feature as long as you enter the wave good and square, as it generate loads of lift up front with those pronounced rails.

I'm not that familiar with the smaller Rings hull design in terms of deadrise, but they clearly have the same design thinking on their FWD sections.

But hey, each to their own, if the Ring works better for you in the rough, that's cool;)