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Old 04-04-2007, 12:05 AM   #1
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The Police

It appears i'm going to get 3points and a £60 fine for using my mobile whilst driving. Stupid thing is I wasn't. A letter was hand delivered by a police officer to my office at 15.38 hours today stating that he had seen me at 13.46 hours using the phone whilst driving. I immediatly checked my call register and i haddn't recieved or made any calls anywhere near that time. I also have a hands free kit fitted so don't hold the phone to my ear anyway. I went to the police station to prove that i haddn't used the phone but they said thre was nothing they could doas i could have deleted the call register. This is utter crap as it would have had a missing entry. I don't even recall seeing the police so can only assume that they were on foot as they didn't even stop me to check to see if they were correct. i could have been scratching my head or anything but because they caught a glimps of what they thought was me on the telephone i now have 3points!
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Old 04-04-2007, 12:13 AM   #2
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Mobile phone company records

Are you on a mobile contract?

If so should be able to get an itemised bill from yr network provider....maybe even possible if it's pay as u go?
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Old 04-04-2007, 12:21 AM   #3
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Yup, ta I'll give them a call tomorrow. Still annoying though what happened to innocent until proven guilty????
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Old 04-04-2007, 01:12 AM   #4
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interesting thread

Bad luck Burty, but you're not alone. This thread is quite long but interesting:
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/....html?t=415444
and concerns someone in your predicament. They are contesting it in court. The choices are
1) take it on the chin, pay, and you're assumed guilty. End of story (insurance premium may also rise)
2) fight it and you might win -scot free hunky dory, or lose - possible bigger fine, possible more points, costs, possible disqualification. No way to predict which, depends on magistrate, your performance, your solicitor (if you pay one), cop turning up and the accuracy of his evidence.

Hope this helps a bit. Good luck anyway.
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Old 04-04-2007, 07:40 AM   #5
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Do itemised bills provide incoming calls as well.

If you do go to court then in my experience defend your self. Showing abit of fear in a court shows your true feelings and that your not trying to be flash with a breif
Remember they have to prove that you were on the phone by providing evidence.
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Old 04-04-2007, 08:53 AM   #6
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Inform the police that you are going to contest the charge and defend yourself. Ask to see all the evidence that will be used in court, its your right, then sum up what they have got on you and ask yourself would I convict someone on this evidence? Usually once you start costing them time and effort on such a trivial case they will drop it.
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Old 04-04-2007, 09:00 AM   #7
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if you have seen Burty, you know he always looks guilty . . . . .
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Old 04-04-2007, 09:14 AM   #8
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Well in case it passed un-noticed there are many changes within the UK all for the worse with very much guilty unless you prove otherwise assumed.
They would do far better sorting out some of the old outstanding crap than start the new stuff, see a few leftovers below

1 No cows may be driven down the roadway between 10 AM and 7 PM unless there is prior approval from the Commissioner of Police.

2 Since 1313, MPs are not allowed to don armor in Parliament.

3 Those wishing to purchase a television must also buy a license.

4 All English males over the age 14 are to carry out 2 or so hours of longbow practice a week supervised by the local clergy.

5 London Hackney Carriages (taxis/cabs) must carry a bale of hay and a sack of oats.

6 It is illegal to be drunk on Licensed Premises (in a pub or bar).

7 It is illegal for a lady to eat chocolates on a public conveyance

8 Any boy under the age of 10 may not see a naked manequin.

9 Any person found breaking a boiled egg at the sharp end will be sentenced to 24 hours in the village stocks (enacted by Edward VI).

10. It is illegal to commit suiscide (least of your problems!!!!)
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Old 04-04-2007, 10:06 AM   #9
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I asked a cabbie about no.5 a few years back. He reckoned that one had been abolished.
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Old 04-04-2007, 10:16 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the bandit View Post
Do itemised bills provide incoming calls as well.
No. I have contacted my network provider who cannot provide me with a list of incoming calls as this can only be provided if the police ask for it! Great cus they aint guna do that are they!!!!!
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Old 04-04-2007, 10:23 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burty View Post
No. I have contacted my network provider who cannot provide me with a list of incoming calls as this can only be provided if the police ask for it! Great cus they aint guna do that are they!!!!!

Looks like you will get off then!
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Old 04-04-2007, 10:59 AM   #12
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Even if a list of incoming calls were available, they could say that you could have been on another phone (a second of your own, maybe even a PAYG, or someone elses) and that their evidence was an upright, unquestionable pillar of society (policeman) seeing you with his own eyes.

Good luck, but it don't look good mate.

All coppers are.....
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Old 04-04-2007, 11:04 AM   #13
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I still laugh about when you said that in front of one!

Is it not the case that they have to have 2 sources of evidence.
Often this is the copper, and his camera.
Or the copper, and his mate or another witness.

My mate got stopped doing 110 by a dog van once, but had to be let off since the dog wasn't a valid witness.

Anyway, I reckon Burty's guilty - he's got a shifty look about him.
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Old 04-04-2007, 11:45 AM   #14
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Quote:
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IMy mate got stopped doing 110 by a dog van once, but had to be let off since the dog wasn't a valid witness.
That must have been very frustrating for the Dog, seeing as he was probably the 'Brains' of the partnership!
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Old 04-04-2007, 12:51 PM   #15
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All coppers are.....
At last!

After 5 years, ive actually found something we both agree on Jon.
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Old 04-04-2007, 02:01 PM   #16
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If they havn't stopped you how can the prove you were the driver ?
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Old 04-04-2007, 02:36 PM   #17
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Police

Burty

How did the police know where you worked, even a company car wont show you as the owner, cant see the police doing hand deliveries, are you sure its genuine, and not a wind up.
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Old 04-04-2007, 02:48 PM   #18
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The CPS Inspectorate published a report entitled 'The Thematic Review of the Disclosure of Unused Material'. In a survey of 631 cases, the Inspectorate found that evidence written on 1 in 3 police forms was in insufficient detail or omitted.

Thus 33% of the time requesting the evidence will result in the charges being dropped, as the Police realise they can not proceed.


Write to the Police, outlining your case, and request that all evidence be forwarded to you. Ask for the notes, statements, video and other photographic evidence in this case. If they do not provide this to you it will harm their case in court if they decide to use evidence not disclosed when you requested it.
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Old 04-04-2007, 02:49 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Fuller View Post
Even if a list of incoming calls were available, they could say that you could have been on another phone (a second of your own, maybe even a PAYG, or someone elses)

Did they actually state you were on the phone (holding it to your ear) or just using it? They may be claiming that you weren't actually making a phone call but instead just pressing buttons, reading a text or something. Are you sure you weren't doing something along these lines?
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Old 04-04-2007, 03:28 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbe1 View Post
Burty

How did the police know where you worked, even a company car wont show you as the owner, cant see the police doing hand deliveries, are you sure its genuine, and not a wind up.

Defo not a wind up, The letter is addressed to the company secretary asking for information on who was driving.
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