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Old 02-09-2009, 08:34 PM   #1
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New Diesel Engine - Buck Marine Diesel

Just wanted to get the word out on a new type of Diesel Engine. This engine is called Buck Marine Diesel.

I work at Buck Marine Diesel. We are currently developing a prototype diesel engine specifically designed for inboard marine use, with possible OTR applications to come later. We're still working on things right now. We have the first prototype up and running.

We are currently working on a 6-cylinder model with 3- and 4-cylinder models to follow. The engines have a unique two injector per cylinder design that will increase the fuel mapping potential exponentially and result in lower emissions capability. The family of engines will range from 150 to 700+ HP and have been designed from the bottom up with a totally different approach. These engines are capable of exceptional cooling, allowing for substantial improvements in power output while increasing longevity.

The cooling path for this engine is a fraction of most engines. In the classic designs, coolant flows into the front of the engine, all the way back to the rear cylinder, then back out the front. This means that the rear cylinder is always receiving water that has already been heated by the previous cylinders.

In the Buck Marine system, the coolant flows individually into and out of each cylinder. This means that the all of the cylinders will be operating at the same temperature at all times. Using individual and shorter cooling paths, will also help eliminate hot spots and temperature stacking.

The engine also has a dual cooling system that uses both an internal coolant as well as circulating raw water from whatever body of water the boat is in. This cooling system will keep the engine running cool, allowing us to generate more power. If a problem should arise, the engine is also very serviceable.

The modular cylinder design allows for easy maintenance. With our design, you can change an individual cylinder, head, piston, and connecting rod without having to remove the crank case. We are estimating that the entire upper half of the engine (cylinders, heads, pistons, and connecting rods ) could be entirely replaced in about 2 hours time. Each of the aforementioned parts is also interchangeable with each of the other cylinders. In addition, nearly every seal is made with an o-ring of some form, meaning that the gasket set for the entire engine can fit in a gallon-sized plastic bag. These two factors will significantly reduce part inventory.

While running under a moderate load at about 2500 rpm, the exhaust temperatures were around 1200 degrees F. We ran under those conditions for about 15 minutes. The hottest that the coolant pump got was about 150 degrees F. None of the 6 heads were over 135 degrees and all of them were within about 3 degrees of one another. You could lay your hands on top of the valve covers.

Feel free to ask any questions that you have.

Check out our website for further pictures and videos.
Buck Marine Diesel

This video shows the tear down and rebuilding of a cylinder, all done in less than 8 minutes!


This is a video of our engine up and running:
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Old 02-09-2009, 09:25 PM   #2
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Do you have an idea on prices?

What drive/gearbox combos are you intending to utilize?

And under what conditions have you tested your chosen drives?

Have you come to any arrangement with manufacturers of said drives that will allow you to offer an all round package at a reasonable cost.

Do you have dealers in the UK and Europe, if so how many and where?

Are your engines just for trawler or cruisers or can they be used in high HP powerboat application?

Thanks

Rick
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Old 02-09-2009, 10:02 PM   #3
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oh and what rpm will she run at
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Old 02-09-2009, 10:53 PM   #4
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Seems to me if that engine does what they say it does, it could be revolutionary!! I'm interested to know how power to weight ratios compare to a BBC?

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Old 03-09-2009, 10:37 AM   #5
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Happy to put a couple in our new boat for next season if they're for racers! What CC are the 6 cylinder motors, the classes are based on engine size not HP.
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Old 03-09-2009, 12:50 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimbillyOSU View Post
Just wanted to get the word out on a new type of Diesel Engine. This engine is called Buck Marine Diesel.
Hi posted this on the CTC forum as I thought it sounded like just the kind of engine that suited endurance, and especially in the RB2012 given the ease of rebuild

success in these endurance races I would of thought could prove great advertising all over the world especially given the power of the internet to reach out to new markets
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Old 03-09-2009, 04:11 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by lain View Post
Do you have an idea on prices?

What drive/gearbox combos are you intending to utilize?

And under what conditions have you tested your chosen drives?

Have you come to any arrangement with manufacturers of said drives that will allow you to offer an all round package at a reasonable cost.

Do you have dealers in the UK and Europe, if so how many and where?

Are your engines just for trawler or cruisers or can they be used in high HP powerboat application?

Thanks

Rick

oh and what rpm will she run at
I can't give you a firm price for retail, yet. As of now, we are still working on getting the funding to move from the prototype stage into full-scale production. All I can say is that we will be competitively priced with what is currently in the market.

We do not have a recommended drive at this time. The bellhousing is a standard SAE-2 size so anything that will fit should be able to be made to work.

We do not have any dealers anywhere yet. As I said, until we secure funding, we cannot move forward. Once we get the funding, we plan on getting about 30 engines out in the field and getting some hours on them while we are doing our own durability tests on our in-house dyno.

We have plans to possibly make a "Performance" line of engines that will include aluminum blocks and a few other improvements. However, this is still a few years off.

We are hoping to make our max torque around 3000 rpm and max hp at 3500 rpm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by larby View Post
Seems to me if that engine does what they say it does, it could be revolutionary!! I'm interested to know how power to weight ratios compare to a BBC?

James
It's tough to compare a diesel to a gas engine on performance. We are hoping to produce about 700 hp from our 6-cylinder engine. While a BB-Chevy V-8 might be producing 800 hp, they are only producing about 1000 ft-lbs of torque to our estimated 1400 ft-lbs... Our 6-cylinder, ready-to-run, weighs in at about 1500 lbs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cookee View Post
Happy to put a couple in our new boat for next season if they're for racers! What CC are the 6 cylinder motors, the classes are based on engine size not HP.
The 6-cylinder in the videos is the one we are currently running. It is a 7.6L engine, ~463 ci or 7600 CC. We have already decided to make some modifications to piston size and crank throw that will increase the displacement to 9.5L, 9500 CC, or about 580 ci.



Keep the questions coming
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Old 09-09-2009, 03:03 AM   #8
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So your engine makes 1,225 lbs of operating torque at full rpm (3,000 you stated)

6.7 Ltr. same as the Cummins who supply FPT and the power is on par with what Cummins claims is possible with their 6.7 ltr engine. Your weight is very close to theirs as well.

Best suggestion is to enter the market priced under the competition rather than at the competition. You can always raise your prices later but there has to be a reason the consumer will want to gamble on your company rather than going with the tried and proven approach that the other diesel manufactures offer.

Shave some weight, increase the power and you have an "in demand" item. Simulate others and you will hard to pick over the others.

The original question was raised as to what drive you can package this engine to. An I/O is not going to handle your power.
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Old 09-09-2009, 02:27 PM   #9
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So your engine makes 1,225 lbs of operating torque at full rpm (3,000 you stated)

6.7 Ltr. same as the Cummins who supply FPT and the power is on par with what Cummins claims is possible with their 6.7 ltr engine. Your weight is very close to theirs as well.

Best suggestion is to enter the market priced under the competition rather than at the competition. You can always raise your prices later but there has to be a reason the consumer will want to gamble on your company rather than going with the tried and proven approach that the other diesel manufactures offer.

Shave some weight, increase the power and you have an "in demand" item. Simulate others and you will hard to pick over the others.

The original question was raised as to what drive you can package this engine to. An I/O is not going to handle your power.
When did I say it would make 1,225 ft-lbs?

I said our production engines should produce 1,400 ft-lbs.

I also said that our current engine is 7.6L, not 6.7, and that we will be moving up to 9.5L of displacement. Please do not put words into my mouth.

What on this engine do you feel is "simulating" others? We feel the serviceability of this engine far outstrips anything else in the market. Being priced competitively, with the ease of service and the other advantages that our engine offers should put us ahead of the others.

I'm not sure how you all feel, but most people that we talk to are fed up with their inboard diesels. The are a pain to work on seems to be the biggest complaint. We have come up with an engine design that we feel will help to reduce these complaints.

At this stage in the testing, we are not suggesting a certain type of drive because we have yet to try any. We are not working on drives. We are working on this engine. If we were to suggest a drive, we will enter the debate of "which is best" that everyone has. As of now, we are only focusing on making what we have better.

We are also working diligently on securing funding. Without the money to move forward, all that we have done so far is all-for-naught. Unfortunately, until we get that capital, we cannot make any moves forward.
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Old 09-09-2009, 09:46 PM   #10
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DAMN your super sensitive. Maybe you should not be the one that post things on the internet.

I take back what I said now that I misread your engine volume. 7.6 ltr 700 hp is average, not good.

FYI, a little math. 700 hp @ 3,000 rpm = 1, 225 lbs of Torque. 700 hp @ 3,500 rpm = 1, 050 lbs of Torque. You can make 1, 400 lbs at some low rpm but the boat runs top speed at top rpm and this is all there is unless you plan on signing off on warranty on an application that does not reach full rpm??? I know Cummins, Yanmar, MTU, MANN, Yamaha, Caterpillar, IVECO, FPT, etc. etc.. all would make this point very clear to me upon the first sea trial.

Simulating refers to ďsame basic package" meaning same size, weight and power as to what is already out there. A market without comparisons only exist in Germany due to their advertising laws. So the rest of the world is free to compare your goods against other goods. You want the going rate for your motors when you have no market share, not distribution, no facilities across the world, no market penetration and mostly importantly at this point in life, no enhanced resale value to offer. I think my reasoning is very solid.

As for comments about what people are sick of working on? When was the last time you asked the owner of the boat if he cared about the difficulty of working on the engine? 700 hp engines are going to be used in a boat that is typically 50í range. A bit much for a back yard mechanic and why would they care as these things come with a warranty serviced by the manufacturers with their field agent and technicians that are always close by.

I am all for a better design, better engineering, better everything. But state it for what it is, a better design, not a " fed up with their inboard diesels. The are a pain to work..." Is this your real motivation?

From a business person who may or may not be in the boating business too. Finish your engine development. Get #'s together that are repeatable and presentable, work out all your bugs that have kept you from giving the hard #'s and take this excellent design to another manufacturer and either partner with them or sell it to them because if it is better they are going to adopt your technology anyways and you will be left out in the cold still looking for capital.

Gaining market share cost far more than the engine development ever could. Using a technical partner (like one of the engine manufacturers listed above) will make you a wealthier person and keep you from wasting all your resources.

Of course you do not have any #ís, kind of like saying Iím a dad before you ever get laid, but what about tier 3 emissions? I know Caterpillar is stopping their C12ís and up due to this matter. Possibly if your design is better they and you can benefit together.

Please remember, you asked. And yes there are a lot of people with answers to your problems and not their own.
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Old 10-09-2009, 01:12 AM   #11
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All seems a little harsh Boatless.

These guys are just giving an early doors insight into what they have under development at the moment and here you are berating their marketing tactics.

If you read closely all the numbers (estimated) which you have used relate to the 7.6 litre and they have already stated they plan to move it to 9.6 litre anyway.

The innovation here is the cooling method and ability to swap out cylinders easily making it an interesting approach to something like the round britain.

Push the boundaries of power from volume and the damage can be put right in double quick time. Build to a spec where 20 hrs running is to be expected and rebuild in the boat could have potential. Whether it all turns out to be atractive or not only time will tell.
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Old 10-09-2009, 07:50 AM   #12
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I stand by what I said. (typed) he asked and I gave an honest opinion then...

The motor design seems (can't accurately comment as there is no hard #'s) good, but they have been running it long enough to have an honest hp and torque number. I have seen his You Tube video and it seems a very simple design from a service point of view and the engine runs on a dyno, therefore what does the dyno say?

Promote it when there is something to promote. Imagine what the Dragons would say..

I just feel if he has a nasty attitude, then he should have presented it as follows:

Example

"Hey guys, we have developed a new design diesel engine that incorporates a individual cylinder design with exceptional cooling characteristics. We have run this engine design on a dyno and we achieved *** (700) hp at and operating rpm of **** (3,000 or 3,500). We achieved a peak torque of 1,400 lbs at **** rpm. We have put ** hours on this engine design on our dyno with no problems to date. etc. etc.."

Then go into why it is better than the alternatives.

Explain your business plan with hard facts that cannot be disputed and he will be amazed at the responses rather than the "give me one to try" responses.
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Old 10-09-2009, 09:37 AM   #13
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I stand by what I said. (typed) he asked and I gave an honest opinion then...
You'd make a great dragon ... are you joining the series ... if so can I get investment for my new concrete paper bags and lawn turfing the living room ideas
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Old 10-09-2009, 01:16 PM   #14
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You'd make a great dragon ... are you joining the series ... if so can I get investment for my new concrete paper bags and lawn turfing the living room ideas
How do you stop the dogs taking a dump on the living room turf ?????
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Old 10-09-2009, 03:10 PM   #15
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How do you stop the dogs taking a dump on the living room turf ?????
no need we've found the dog rarely goes in their since our newly patented cow tethered to the radiator idea to keep the grass cut giving free compost for the plant pots, plus free warm milk in the morning on ye cereals ... come on investors they never no a good idea when they see one
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Old 10-09-2009, 05:47 PM   #16
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I hope Buck do attain a market share, choice is always a good thing.

I am curious what is wrong with normal cooling on current diesels. From my understanding of head gaskets on petrols have different sized holes along their length to help even the cooling from front to rear. I can understand how the buck system is more even but how critical is this?

Also what history has Buck in modifying current diesels. Forgive me if I didn't read the whole of your website but from memory I didn't notice any concrete lineage of development. Did Buck just work on diesels, get annoyed with working on them and decide to make his own one. Or was there an interim step of modifying current makes of diesels and if so have you got any information on what you achieved and where these engine were used?

This leads to my next question, where are you coming from, what's your aim? performance; replacement of current diesels with a like product that is easier to service and who are you catering for?

Who do you see as your main competition, are you attempting to be the end all as a petrol replacement or just shooting at trawlers?

Are your engines computer controlled, do they use variable vane turbos.

All these questions should be answered on your website, preferably on a blog.
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Old 10-09-2009, 07:14 PM   #17
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How do you stop the dogs taking a dump on the living room turf ?????
That's funny..
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Old 10-09-2009, 07:18 PM   #18
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I hope Buck do attain a market share, choice is always a good thing.

I am curious what is wrong with normal cooling on current diesels. From my understanding of head gaskets on petrols have different sized holes along their length to help even the cooling from front to rear. I can understand how the buck system is more even but how critical is this?

Also what history has Buck in modifying current diesels. Forgive me if I didn't read the whole of your website but from memory I didn't notice any concrete lineage of development. Did Buck just work on diesels, get annoyed with working on them and decide to make his own one. Or was there an interim step of modifying current makes of diesels and if so have you got any information on what you achieved and where these engine were used?

This leads to my next question, where are you coming from, what's your aim? performance; replacement of current diesels with a like product that is easier to service and who are you catering for?

Who do you see as your main competition, are you attempting to be the end all as a petrol replacement or just shooting at trawlers?

Are your engines computer controlled, do they use variable vane turbos.

All these questions should be answered on your website, preferably on a blog.
The normal methods of cooling are fine on both diesels and petrols whilst everything is operating at it's optimum. The problems start to occur when something goes awry such as an under performing heat exchanger, broken impeller vane, bag round the inlet etc. at that point the serial cooling will underperform, the temps will vary across the block and it will generally be the last cylinder in the circuit that gets the damage.

I imagine their system will have the same difficulties with underperforming cooling at some point but I can see the logic in maintaining even temps across the board albeit still an overheat situation but damage lessened as the overheat is spread across the whole block and not focused in one area.

Marine diesels for pleasure use generally have a crap duty life of sometimes only 1000hrs and the bit that tends to go is pistons and liners so I like the idea of swapping these out without tearing the boat apart to get the engines out. To be honest the principle is not new just a furtherance of what they already do on large commercials where it's not funny to be taking out an engine weighing many tons from an engine room without a hole big enough for it to come out of. Some of them can even carry on running whilst the piston / cylinder is out for repair!

They also seem to be going for commonanility of parts across the intended range which has to be good for replacement costs / availability.

Their background is explained in the about us section of their website. He's a painter and decorator by trade
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Old 11-09-2009, 06:32 PM   #19
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DAMN your super sensitive. Maybe you should not be the one that post things on the internet.
I'm sorry, I tend to get agitated when people don't read what I have written then tell me that I am wrong...

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FYI, a little math. 700 hp @ 3,000 rpm = 1, 225 lbs of Torque. 700 hp @ 3,500 rpm = 1, 050 lbs of Torque. You can make 1, 400 lbs at some low rpm but the boat runs top speed at top rpm and this is all there is unless you plan on signing off on warranty on an application that does not reach full rpm??? I know Cummins, Yanmar, MTU, MANN, Yamaha, Caterpillar, IVECO, FPT, etc. etc.. all would make this point very clear to me upon the first sea trial.
We plan on reaching our max TORQUE at a lower RPM. Max HP will be around 3,000 rpm.

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Simulating refers to ďsame basic package" meaning same size, weight and power as to what is already out there. A market without comparisons only exist in Germany due to their advertising laws. So the rest of the world is free to compare your goods against other goods. You want the going rate for your motors when you have no market share, not distribution, no facilities across the world, no market penetration and mostly importantly at this point in life, no enhanced resale value to offer. I think my reasoning is very solid.
If we do not "simulate" the same basic size as other engines, we don't have a prayer. No matter how good an engine is, if you have to totally reconfigure your boat to install it, you're not going to. Please tell me what marine diesel produces 700 hp while weighing 1,500 lbs. I have never seen one. All of the ones I have seen in that range are easily 2,500+ lbs.

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As for comments about what people are sick of working on? When was the last time you asked the owner of the boat if he cared about the difficulty of working on the engine? 700 hp engines are going to be used in a boat that is typically 50í range. A bit much for a back yard mechanic and why would they care as these things come with a warranty serviced by the manufacturers with their field agent and technicians that are always close by.
So you don't think that someone that has a 50' boat would prefer an engine that doesn't require cutting large holes in the boat for repair work? I'll agree that that is not the first thing on their minds. But, if given the choice, why wouldn't they prefer one that could be repaired in place? Also, if you again would read what I have written, we are planning on making 3, 4, AND 6-cylinder models. So far, we have a had a lot of interest in the 3. This design is for more than just the 6.

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From a business person who may or may not be in the boating business too. Finish your engine development. Get #'s together that are repeatable and presentable, work out all your bugs that have kept you from giving the hard #'s and take this excellent design to another manufacturer and either partner with them or sell it to them because if it is better they are going to adopt your technology anyways and you will be left out in the cold still looking for capital.
Do you honestly think we haven't tried that? Anyone that might actually have some sway at any of the large companies that we have ever spoken to has the mentality of, "we didn't design it, it won't work." I'm not sure what your background is, but I know that a lot of people won't give us any recognition because they just see Mike as some old hillbilly out in the middle-of-nowhere, North Carolina. So far, we have 3 patents on the designs (the numbers are listed on the website if you want to check them out) which we are hoping will help protect us from "being left out in the cold."

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Of course you do not have any #ís, kind of like saying Iím a dad before you ever get laid,
I'm really missing your reasoning here... We have design and built a prototype of a new diesel engine. That in itself is impressive to me. Let me type that again in case you missed it,

We have designed, machined, tweaked, checked, re-designed (a few times), re-machined (a few times), re-checked, built, and are testing a PROTOTYPE of a new diesel engine.

I can guarantee you that no matter how pretty they make things look, the numbers Cat and everyone else tells you that their engines output is NOT what their first prototype did. We know that we still have a few tweaks that we need to make. You seem to be thinking that everything I am saying is set in stone. This engine is still a PROTOTYPE.


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but what about tier 3 emissions? I know Caterpillar is stopping their C12ís and up due to this matter. Possibly if your design is better they and you can benefit together.
We have not done any emissions testing as of yet. We have things designed into this engine that SHOULD reduce emissions (dual injectors per cylinder for example). I'm not saying it will or it has, it should.

As for the last part, see above...

I am kind of curious because you seem to have that "not designed here" mentality. Which of the large engine manufacturer's do you work for?

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All seems a little harsh Boatless.

These guys are just giving an early doors insight into what they have under development at the moment and here you are berating their marketing tactics.

If you read closely all the numbers (estimated) which you have used relate to the 7.6 litre and they have already stated they plan to move it to 9.6 litre anyway.

The innovation here is the cooling method and ability to swap out cylinders easily making it an interesting approach to something like the round britain.

Push the boundaries of power from volume and the damage can be put right in double quick time. Build to a spec where 20 hrs running is to be expected and rebuild in the boat could have potential. Whether it all turns out to be atractive or not only time will tell.

Thanks motorvator. Something everyone seems to lose sight of is that it is not "if" an engine is going to fail, it is "when". I actually had an engineer at one of the larger companies (I won't say who, but it is named after an industrial city in Michigan) tell me that if an engine is designed well enough, it'll never break down...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boatless-Again View Post
I stand by what I said. (typed) he asked and I gave an honest opinion then...

The motor design seems (can't accurately comment as there is no hard #'s) good, but they have been running it long enough to have an honest hp and torque number. I have seen his You Tube video and it seems a very simple design from a service point of view and the engine runs on a dyno, therefore what does the dyno say?

Promote it when there is something to promote. Imagine what the Dragons would say..

I just feel if he has a nasty attitude, then he should have presented it as follows:

Example

"Hey guys, we have developed a new design diesel engine that incorporates a individual cylinder design with exceptional cooling characteristics. We have run this engine design on a dyno and we achieved *** (700) hp at and operating rpm of **** (3,000 or 3,500). We achieved a peak torque of 1,400 lbs at **** rpm. We have put ** hours on this engine design on our dyno with no problems to date. etc. etc.."

Then go into why it is better than the alternatives.

Explain your business plan with hard facts that cannot be disputed and he will be amazed at the responses rather than the "give me one to try" responses.
We already have a slew of people saying "give me one to try." I have not given any power numbers because nothing is finalized. I say that we are expecting 700 hp at 3,000 rpm and 1,400 ft-lbs of torque (at a lower rpm) because that is what the engine is design to produce. There is still some further testing and tuning that needs to be done before that is a reality.

Our biggest issue is in the fuel injectors. Right now, the engine is running on injectors that come from a Ford Focus diesel in the UK. The engine they are from produces about 90 hp from a 4-cylinder. Needless to say, these are NOT our production injectors. However, until we can find the funding and have the money necessary to buy/build better injectors, we have to work with what we could get. (The reason we are running those injectors is that they were all that we could find that would fit what we have designed with our high-pressure common rail. We have another set of injectors that we had custom-made for this engine. Unfortunately, we found out later that the company that made them for us outsourced the work to China and the injectors will not function properly. Trying to order 12 or 24 injectors from a company like Bosch is impossible. If you are dealing with quantities less than about 100,000, they have no interest in helping you.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by lain View Post
I hope Buck do attain a market share, choice is always a good thing.

I am curious what is wrong with normal cooling on current diesels. From my understanding of head gaskets on petrols have different sized holes along their length to help even the cooling from front to rear. I can understand how the buck system is more even but how critical is this?
The problem with inline engines is the cooling path. The coolant generally enters the front of the engine, travels all the way back along one side of it, then comes back to the front of the engine along the other side. This means that you form hot spots between the cylinders (because there is no coolant flow between them), the rear cylinder is always receiving hot coolant (it has been heated by the other cylinders), and one side of your engine and cylinders is always going to be warmer (the return side). In our design, the coolant flows to each cylinder individually. Which means every cylinder is receiving the exact same temperature coolant. With our cylinder jug design, coolant flows all the way around each cylinder, which means no hot spots. Also, since the coolant path around each cylinder is much shorter, we can recycle the coolant that is around the cylinders about 15 times faster than anyone else. We check the head temperatures sporadically every time we run the engine. We have never had a case when we have had one cylinder more than 5 degrees hotter or colder than any of the others. Having the cylinders all running at the same temperature will also help to make the wear more even throughout. By comparison, one of the older Cat engines had such trouble with cylinder warping due to lack of cooling in the rear cylinder that the rebuild manual called for that cylinder to be over-bored by about 0.010" more than the others. (This is a very extreme case, I'm just using it to emphasize what can happen.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by lain View Post
Also what history has Buck in modifying current diesels. Forgive me if I didn't read the whole of your website but from memory I didn't notice any concrete lineage of development. Did Buck just work on diesels, get annoyed with working on them and decide to make his own one. Or was there an interim step of modifying current makes of diesels and if so have you got any information on what you achieved and where these engine were used?
Mike's original business in our current building was performance and tuning upgrades for marine, road, and track engines for others. He is also an avid offshore fisherman. He has a 28' boat that is sitting behind the shop that was really the start of all this. He was out fishing one day and one of the engines died. After he got back to port, he had the engine replaced. This involved basically cutting the entire salon floor out of the boat. A few months later, it happened to the other engine.

Mike began looking into other engines and found that the cooling of the cylinders was a major cause of most failures. So he began looking for other engines to modify. He began with a New Holland engine out of a tractor. This engine was made to produce about 90 hp from their factory. After Mike and his team's tweaking and redesigning, it was cooling better than before and producing nearly 300 HP! However, Mike couldn't strike a deal with New Holland to just get the parts that he wanted (they wanted to sell him entire engines).

At the Miami Boat Show, Mike had rented a booth that he had planned to show off these New Holland engines. Instead, he spent the entire show walking around and talking to people and getting ideas on what they did and didn't like about current marine diesels. From there, he spent the next few years designing up the first version of our current engine. Over the past few years, we have worked to turn those designs into the engine that you see in the pictures and videos on the website.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lain View Post
This leads to my next question, where are you coming from, what's your aim? performance; replacement of current diesels with a like product that is easier to service and who are you catering for?

Who do you see as your main competition, are you attempting to be the end all as a petrol replacement or just shooting at trawlers?
We are aiming to produce an engine that will perform as it should and make things easier for the service techs and boat owners that have to work on them. We would hopefully be a replacement for any inboard engine between 150 and 700 hp. We are not really focusing our attention on any particular section of the boating industry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lain View Post
Are your engines computer controlled, do they use variable vane turbos.
We have computer on the fuel control system. It regulates the amount of time the injectors are open during each pulse, the duty cycle of the furl pump, and the timing of the fuel injection before top dead center.

One of the ideas that we are considering is similar to what is being used in the VW clean diesel which is using the dynamic cylinder pressure data to meter the fuel flow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by motorvator View Post
The normal methods of cooling are fine on both diesels and petrols whilst everything is operating at it's optimum. The problems start to occur when something goes awry such as an under performing heat exchanger, broken impeller vane, bag round the inlet etc. at that point the serial cooling will underperform, the temps will vary across the block and it will generally be the last cylinder in the circuit that gets the damage.

I imagine their system will have the same difficulties with underperforming cooling at some point but I can see the logic in maintaining even temps across the board albeit still an overheat situation but damage lessened as the overheat is spread across the whole block and not focused in one area.
One thing to keep in mind is that since the cylinder jugs are not siamese, we have a 3/16" air gap between them. Couple that with a majority of aluminum parts, and this engine has a pretty high amount of heat rejection.

We have tested our cooling system in the event of a raw water pump failure, to a certain degree. We started the engine one day without the raw water pump bolted on. We decided we would run at an idle until the engine reached 200 degrees. It took about an hr...
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Old 12-09-2009, 08:02 AM   #20
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Sorry, but you are DENSE. This is not a reference to weight by the way.

Read my comments without getting hot headed. I could care less where or who made this engine. Understand this is constructive criticism not a personal attack. If you don't want to be treated like a dumb hillbilly, then don't act like one.

1. Torque, I'm still correct on that. You are only able to make 1225 lbs at your 3,000 rpm level. Accept it and move on.

2. Cummins QSM11, 715 hp @ 3,000 rpm. No where near 2,500 lbs.

3. Owners don't give a rats ass. They have dealer support and it is never their azz hole and elbow in the bilge, its someone else, meaning the engine support guys who are factory trained to work and service these engines under warranty.

I am not saying that the design is not great, not needed, not warranted. Just you need more sizzle than that to make the engine sell. Yes it is neat to the mechanics but they can't afford the engine much less the boat to put them in. This will pay off in the FUTURE as the second, third owner will be far more concerned about service after the manufacturer's warranty has expired. Please note, a used boat can have a manufacturer's warranty on the engines if the new owner has the dealers rebuild and certify the engines. Your sizzle has far more bearing toward the next owner than the first buyer.

4. Don't present yourself, nor acknowledge yourself to be a f'n hillbilly. As for US history is full of your Dumb Hillbillies being the president of your country. Don't let your birth demographics limit your abilities. Be more self confident, more assertive and professional and you will be more successful. Look North to the little redneck that owns Fountain Powerboats. It didn't limit him so don't let it limit you.

5. A large part of being professional is being prepared and having facts do the talking for you. My comments are to the fact that you have no facts. If you went into any meeting with dyno sheets, an actual engine that could run on a stand or better yet on a dyno in front of people you would get their respect and attention and possibly some of their money.

You have been on a lot of Internet sites talking about this engine (great) but you have dodged any concrete answers to power and torque. Even boat manufacturers can run the plug and say it did this before they teak and refine it for the customers. What is your "this"? It is not that hard and if it is a secret, then you should have not come onto the Internet speaking about it. Believe me, the investors will be 10X worst on you than I am being and they will not give you any advice to help you.

Like the Dragons, the better you are prepared the easier it is to get money out of them.


6. & Final. " am kind of curious because you seem to have that "not designed here" mentality. Which of the large engine manufacturer's do you work for?"

For someone who says they get agitated when people do not read, you need to read and COMPREHEND.

I never said it can't be good, nor is it not great, never said there was no confidence in the design nor merits.

I said you talk crap and do not back it up with facts.

Post your HP and Torque curves. Tell the world that you've put this engine in a truck, a car, a farm tractor or heaven for bid a boat and it performed as follows.......

Get on with it.
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