Endurance Racing, the future??

[hunton69]

Mike You will never make it perfect its good to see that you and JF, FB etc are listening, however decisions have to be made and we either like it or lump it or those that don't put there necks on the line.
( Whats the chance of class MR2 ribs 33' to 35' non stepped hulls with big blocks )

So the old folks home has been put on hold

[Mike Lloyd]

Originally Posted by hunton69

So the old folks home has been put on hold

For a couple of years at least so that I can get another "biggy race" under my belt and then you can take over

[Adam]

Originally Posted by OldMan

Therefore it is certainly my intention to discuss with the others the possibility of bringing back in single engined boats for the British Marathon Racing scene as per the original RB08 rules.

It is also obvious that there are a few glaring errors which have been pointed out to us by yourselves, no one is perfect, these again we will discuss shortly. We did say that these were provisional rules and rightly so until they have been agreed with the RYA. I certainly and I am sure the others do also consider it extremely important that these rules are good and fair rules as they will affect everyone for the next three to four years.

Give us a few days on this and we will post again.

ML.

Good to hear and certainly I think much more could be achieved with the rules in accommodating more boats - but also allowing for the future. As written they are in my opinion a bit based on the past and with a bias to diesel engines!

Will be interesting to see how far the organisers (and the sport in general) want to go along the enviromental route. Our sport is never going to be good - but I feel the banning of non epa outboards is such a token gesture - when you are allowing diesel and petrol engines that often don't meet any pollution requirements.

Just my (shortened) thoughts!

[Mike Lloyd]

Originally Posted by Adam

Good to hear and certainly I think much more could be achieved with the rules in accommodating more boats - but also allowing for the future. As written they are in my opinion a bit based on the past and with a bias to diesel engines!

Will be interesting to see how far the organisers (and the sport in general) want to go along the enviromental route. Our sport is never going to be good - but I feel the banning of non epa outboards is such a token gesture - when you are allowing diesel and petrol engines that often don't meet any pollution requirements.

Just my (shortened) thoughts!

The only history that we had to go on in recent years for Marathon racing was the RB08. So what information and stats did we have from that race?

Out of 47 starters 30 were Diesels! 13 were outboards - mostly Optimax and Suzuki, and 4 were inboard Petrol’s so what does that tell you? That those wanting to do this type of racing were, in the majority by a considerable margin, choosing diesels so therefore the emphasis within the rules is on Diesel Engine manufacturers but at the same time it does not exclude ANYONE wanting to race outboards or even naturally aspirated petrol’s competitively.

Re the "green" issue, a token gesture is better than nothing and that is important when dealing with these very difficult people.
ML.

[Adam]

I actually think the green issue is far more important and should be considered across the board rather than just outboards.

It also goes much deeper than just the level of emissions of engines - total fuel used, weights of craft, manufacturing processes, fuel used by support crews etc etc all significant. All areas that can be considered - but may not be practical. However there could be ways in the rules to encourage green / enviromental campaigns? This would perhaps be a better way of appealing to the green movements?

I do think much more could be done to encourage more enviromentally sensitive racing (in some cases) - through lighter, lower powered craft, single engines (with aux) etc.

Regarding outboards - I think it is probably not the best way to go endurance racing - although the modern o/b engine is changing rapidly. However the weight rules are not encouraging this is some of the classes. I would also think that non epa o/b engines will be fairly un-popular and their use would get less as time goes on - but does seem un-fair to rule them out when you see the freedom given to other engine types.

Many issues and very interesting - also many possibilities.

[Tony Davis]

Originally Posted by OldMan

Out of 47 starters 30 were Diesels! 13 were outboards - mostly Optimax and Suzuki, and 4 were inboard Petrol’s so what does that tell you?

I'd have thought very little really, other than it was probably "run what you brung"!

I reckon there was only a couple of boats that were actually built for the event, most were race or pleasure boats that already existed.

All of the classics, Fairy's etc would be running diesels, coz that's what was fitted from new, Majority of the ribs would be outboard, coz that what's works best on them, the Buzzi's are diesel, coz that's what he fits.

As for the green issue, you could run the entire fleet for a season on what a Jumbo uses to cross the Atlantic.

[Pash 1]

Originally Posted by Tony Davis

As for the green issue, you could run the entire fleet for a season on what a Jumbo uses to cross the Atlantic.

And what’s more the Mediterranean Sea has dried up twice in the last Million Years - Now that tells me that either Neanderthal Man either had Twin Big Blocks fitted to his P1 Raft which he was towing behind his Range Rover ......or..... (this could be slightly controversial ) Al Gore and the Guardian Reading Peruvian knitted hat wearing do gooders might have it slightly wrong?

And..... Environmental Consultants along with Health & Safety Consultants now beat Lawyers to be the most hated profession in the country

[hunton69]

Yea but it is a moral booster when you see big black smoke in the distance.

[BluFin]

If one was looking to the future to please enviros - Surprised to see no alternate fuel class.

[motorvator]

Rb08 lots of diesels prior to derogation of fuel. I think the tide might turn the other slightly now.

How long will HMRC allow you to race with 60/40 tax???

[BluFin]

On the enviro front .. Mike and all race organisers, you have far more tolerance and self restraint than I could ever hope to achieve, dunno how you do it sometimes.

[Matt]

Prozac

[Pash 1]

Originally Posted by Matt

Prozac

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

The answer so so many of life's "Little Problems"

[steve h]

Originally Posted by OldMan

The only history that we had to go on in recent years for Marathon racing was the RB08. So what information and stats did we have from that race?

Out of 47 starters 30 were Diesels! 13 were outboards - mostly Optimax and Suzuki, and 4 were inboard Petrol’s so what does that tell you? That those wanting to do this type of racing were, in the majority by a considerable margin, choosing diesels so therefore the emphasis within the rules is on Diesel Engine manufacturers but at the same time it does not exclude ANYONE wanting to race outboards or even naturally aspirated petrol’s competitively.

Re the "green" issue, a token gesture is better than nothing and that is important when dealing with these very difficult people.
ML.

mike in m4 and up the outboard problem is less as 3 litre motors can be used ie 300 xs which runs strong saddles,gearboxs etc and is more suited to racing.
in m5 due to cc only option are production engines and although powerheads will last rest of outboard just isnt strong enough.
take rb08 first night in pits at plymouth a twin engine rib was towed in both standard optis hanging of with mounts,exhaust plates,mids,broke ..when they aproached barrus lads they were told what do you expect there not up to racing, expensive short lived race.
if you want to promote green issue lets check emmissions on all competing boats .

[Jono]

Originally Posted by Pash 1

...

And..... Environmental Consultants along with Health & Safety Consultants now beat Lawyers to be the most hated profession in the country

Nah... "you lot" are still number one... trust me.

[gazza]

[QUOTE=Pash 1;145294]And what’s more the Mediterranean Sea has dried up twice in the last Million Years -

OK Pash whats the chances of you getting D2S in the water by the next time it drys out


gaZ

[Pash 1]

[QUOTE=gazza;145307]

Originally Posted by Pash 1

And what’s more the Mediterranean Sea has dried up twice in the last Million Years

Originally Posted by Pash 1

-

OK Pash whats the chances of you getting D2S in the water by the next time it drys out gaZ

Oh ye of little faith...... watch out for our repower in 2010

Originally Posted by Jono

Nah... "you lot" are still number one... trust me.

Jono without support like yours life would just not be worth the effort in defending you..... God Bless...

[gazza]

[QUOTE=Pash 1;145316

Oh ye of little faith...... watch out for our repower in 2010


Repower 2010!! to repower you firstly need have power and the happ over the the boat does not constitute for a sail Martin,

Good luck with the project, when is D2S going in that nice warm workshop that the TEAM 25 chaps are in,

gaZ

[BluFin]

Originally Posted by gazza

when is D2S going in that nice warm workshop that the TEAM 25 chaps are in, gaZ

Warm workshop.............. Bit Soft - need to toughen up for endurance

[Taz]

Originally Posted by steve h

mike in m4 and up the outboard problem is less as 3 litre motors can be used ie 300 xs which runs strong saddles,gearboxs etc and is more suited to racing.
in m5 due to cc only option are production engines and although powerheads will last rest of outboard just isnt strong enough.
take rb08 first night in pits at plymouth a twin engine rib was towed in both standard optis hanging of with mounts,exhaust plates,mids,broke ..when they aproached barrus lads they were told what do you expect there not up to racing, expensive short lived race.
if you want to promote green issue lets check emmissions on all competing boats .

No one want to listen to someones point of view! or is racing set up to the organisers boats ENTERING?