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Old 15-09-2006, 05:49 PM   #1
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300xs or 4 stroke 300

Bit early to ask yet as the Suzuki 300hp 4stroke is barely out but any ideas which engine would be better suited to a heavy 30' deep V boat(shh it's got tubes around it).

I love 2 strokes and my Suzuki DT225 is fantastic but wouldn't mind a bit more go - 41kts at moment but may see 50 with the right prop but the hull is so good I want more. Don't want twins as it will upset the great balance of the boat and I want to use it on my transom jack.

The new Suzuki looks really tempting but then again so does the Mercury 300 - it is as light as my 225!!! Would it be suited to a heavy boat or would a big 4stroke suite it better?

Would have asked on Ribnet but most of them have never heard of a 300hp mercury.......
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Old 15-09-2006, 07:23 PM   #2
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I would take the Merc 300XS, better torque, higher top end speed, cheaper spareparts and higher resale value.

Not to mention DTS throttles and Smartcraft gauges
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Old 15-09-2006, 07:56 PM   #3
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The 300xs has hardly been out for a long time either.
The article on S&F claims the 300 is the most powerful outboard in production. I would feel for a "performance" boat it's the better option, for a "lugger", the suzi would be fine.
Shame the 300 VMAX isn't out over here.
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Old 15-09-2006, 10:27 PM   #4
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The new Suzuki will have fly by wire steering and throttles as well.
I do like 2 strokes but as I may be carrying up to 12 people maybe the Suzuki will have more grunt at lower speeds??? If not then it will be the Mercury - it is SO light for the size!!!
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Old 16-09-2006, 09:14 AM   #5
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Fly by wire steering
No thank you
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Old 16-09-2006, 01:39 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by Burty
Fly by wire steering
No thank you
On a car I would agree but after using hydraulic systems on boats that have no feel and the same number of turns as a destroyer then maybe it's a good idea. Mercury have also gone this road with the Verado - makes rigging so simple!!!
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Old 16-09-2006, 01:51 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by codprawn
On a car I would agree but after using hydraulic systems on boats that have no feel and the same number of turns as a destroyer then maybe it's a good idea. Mercury have also gone this road with the Verado - makes rigging so simple!!!
I think you need to brush up on your googling skills, coz the verado has hydraulic steering. It does has fly by wire throttle and shift though.
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Old 17-09-2006, 12:36 AM   #8
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Quote:
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I think you need to brush up on your googling skills, coz the verado has hydraulic steering. It does has fly by wire throttle and shift though.
What does ELECTRO hydraulic mean then???
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Old 17-09-2006, 06:21 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by codprawn
What does ELECTRO hydraulic mean then???
It means that the hydraulic pressure/flow is supplied by an electriclydriven pump, rather than one driven via belt or similar from the engine itself.

A lot of modern small cars, such as the citroen saxo etc, use the same idea.
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Old 18-09-2006, 02:58 PM   #10
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So what connects the steering wheel to the steering cylinder on the engine? Would it be wires or is it still hydraulic hoses?
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Old 18-09-2006, 03:06 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by codprawn
So what connects the steering wheel to the steering cylinder on the engine? Would it be wires or is it still hydraulic hoses?

....Fairy dust.
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Old 18-09-2006, 05:53 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jono
....Fairy dust.
Very helpful as always!!!
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Old 18-09-2006, 06:01 PM   #13
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Ahh found it at last - "fly by wire" it is then!!!

The Verado engines also introduce an electro-hydraulic power steering system. The actual steering wheel is an electrical device which sends electrical commands to a remote hydraulic steering pump. The pump can be placed in the helm area or in the transom area, whichever affords the best location on a particular boat. Hydraulic lines from the pump connect to an integral hydraulic steering ram in the Verado engine mount. The hydraulic ram in the engine remains stationary as the engine pivots, so the hydraulic cables do not move. This makes the transom rigging very clean with no long hydraulic cables dragging around the splash well.
The result is a system that eliminates steering torque at the wheel yet claims to provides proper engine "feel." We didn't actually get to try this out while underway in our test ride, but the demonstration display at the booth felt very nice.
This is quite a departure from the traditional engine design, where steering control was left to the builder or rigger.
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Old 18-09-2006, 07:40 PM   #14
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Codders, where did you find that? < Edit: Actually I think you found it here and I reckon it's a mistake! >

Much as I would love to see Jonny, Tony and Jono queuing up to eat humble pie I think they are probably right. I can't find any reference to fly-by-wire steering on a Verado anywhere. This is from the Mercury site:

"Electro-hydraulic Power Steering
Verado has been integrated with electro-hydraulic power steering to steering that is fluid, effortless, and seamless. Unlike conventional hydraulic steering systems, steering torque is completely eliminated. However, the operator does not lose the "feel" which makes Verado a perfect choice for performance and super duty hulls. This system gives Verado the most reliable, efficient, and precise steering system available on an outboard engine today. "

The shift and throttles are fully electronic though, and are pretty cool for triple engin instalations:

"Two throttles, three engines. (Works the same for 4 too). We all know that docking a dual engine boat is simple, to turn the boat or spin it, one engine forward and one in reverse.. Here it is the same way. The middle engine does the same as the other two together. If one is in reverse and the other is forward the center engine stays neutral. Both forward, center engine goes forward and matches the RPMS through the on board DTS Smart Craft Engine Synchronizers. Reverse, well, you get the picture. "
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Old 18-09-2006, 09:04 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by Johnny Rocket

Much as I would love to see Jonny, Tony and Jono queuing up to eat humble pie .....
And I love you too...
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Old 19-09-2006, 03:21 AM   #16
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Well Brunswick MUST know

http://www.brunswick.com/investor/pd...re%20verado%22

Steer by wire it seems to be.....

BUT - looking at Raymarine and others who make autopilots integrated for the Verado it says the helm unit is hydraulic!!! CONFUSED - well I am. Unless there are 2 different systems???
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Old 19-09-2006, 08:52 AM   #17
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Originally posted by codprawn
Well Brunswick MUST know

http://www.brunswick.com/investor/pd...re%20verado%22

Must they? Do you think that the Shell Global performance reports to shareholders are written by someone who has the first clue how a refinery works for instance?

...like I said... Fairy Dust.

PS the Verado Helm unit is available in 32cc, 40cc and 50cc... What do we reckon the cc stands for?
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Old 19-09-2006, 08:57 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jono


the Verado Helm unit is available in 32cc, 40cc and 50cc... What do we reckon the cc stands for?
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Old 19-09-2006, 10:07 AM   #19
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Ask Cookee, he's fitted one.

But being serious for a moment, I've no idea whether the Verado has 'fly by wire', ..it's a clip-on, and i'm not a fan of them, so never really taken much notice.

My reply was just an answer to the question "What does 'electro-mechanical' mean?"
And my understanding is as I explained.

The thought of fly-by for the steering on a fast boat frightens me slightly though. I'll be sticking with good old fashioned hydraulic, helm to drive, no wires!
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Old 19-09-2006, 11:37 AM   #20
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A tilting one.....
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