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28-09-2008, 09:40 AM
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#1
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Registered User
Country: Guernsey
Occupation: Engineering
Boat make: None, boo!
Engines: Turbines mainly!
Cruising area: The inside of my workshop!
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,646
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Advantage of twins on a puma?
Everyone i've spoken to about my new puma has told me to put it back to twins... I had a good look at the conversion to a single motor yesterday, the glassing is a mess and the bolts holding it on have washers made from chequer plate that sit at an angle to the transom on the inside, so are diggging in.
Knowing the abuse it'll get from the seas over here, i've got 2 options. Re-make this bit with much more strength, or just re-rig her with twins
Firstly, would anyone have any close pics of the twins setup on hospitality inns (thistle hotels)? The old bolt holes are in place, but the hull shape has changed a lot, i'd like to be able to see exactly how it was back then!
What kind of advantages will i see from running twins? So far i've been told i'll get more stability and better speed, hoping for 90's.
Last but not least, i'm not on a big budget here, infact i've only just got a budget at all... What motors should i be looking to get?
I'm thinking xr2's... they're not my favourite engine, but they're cheap at the mo and parts should be easy to find!
I'm hoping to get a pair of whatever for the same price as my (mariner branded) 300 promax which is immaculate. If someone's got something, or even better would be interested in a swap, send me a pm!
Basically i'd like to get her running as well as possible without spending too much, i do have a baby on the way!
Any advice would be great
Cheers, James
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28-09-2008, 11:24 AM
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#2
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Registered User
Occupation: Champion Pie Eater
Boat name: On The Rocks
Boat make: Ring 21 marshan 17 four winns horizon, hydro 3 pointer, f2 cat, backdraft 22
Cruising area: Way up norf and Sarf coast areas
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,619
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Twin setup would be best because that is what the boat was designed and built to have, I would imagine the strength would be built for either side of the Transom rather than the middle, Best PM Hutchy who had your boat with a twin set up or Gav who i believe put the top deck on, maybe for the photos.
Scand or Adam here could be contacts on what options are open as they both design
gaZ
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28-09-2008, 11:30 AM
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#3
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Registered User
Country: Guernsey
Occupation: Engineering
Boat make: None, boo!
Engines: Turbines mainly!
Cruising area: The inside of my workshop!
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,646
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cheers for that gaz, from looking at the stern as it is now i think my only option will be to bolt them straight to the back with a small spacer. Due to the new top half i can't have anything forward of the boltholes (imagine the transom carrying on straight up in front of the engine).
I've spoken to steve h on here, he's the one that's really got me thinking about twins. The way i look at it, it'll probably be cheaper to put on a set of xr2's if i can get a pair with steering, rather than strenghtening the centre for the single and still having to get steering!
I don't think i'll go for lifters or anything to start with, it didn't have them when it raced so i may as well keep things simple and cheap!
James
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28-09-2008, 11:56 AM
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#4
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Registered User
Country: UK
Location: Weston Super Mare
Occupation: Electrical Engineer
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Weston Super Mare
Posts: 6,351
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hutchy put the deck on himself, gav just supplied it
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28-09-2008, 12:05 PM
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#5
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Registered User
Occupation: Champion Pie Eater
Boat name: On The Rocks
Boat make: Ring 21 marshan 17 four winns horizon, hydro 3 pointer, f2 cat, backdraft 22
Cruising area: Way up norf and Sarf coast areas
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,619
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28-09-2008, 02:36 PM
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#6
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Registered User
Country: Guernsey
Occupation: Engineering
Boat make: None, boo!
Engines: Turbines mainly!
Cruising area: The inside of my workshop!
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,646
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thats tempting but...
I doubt i'll get a pair of 2.5's for the same kinda price as a 300x and a gorilla lifter
JF himself said the he sh*t his pants at that kinda speed so xr2's should do me fine
Ideal motors for me would be a pair of 2.5 carb motors, doubt i'll get them either tho!
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29-09-2008, 10:50 AM
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#7
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Registered User
Country: UK
Occupation: Designin' Stuff
Interests: Boating/4x4s/Fast Cars
Boat name: Namotu
Boat make: Extreme 24
Engines: 383 Mag Stroker
Cruising area: Channel Isles
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 557
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Alright larby!
Good to hear you've got your new boat, we were out in Charlies yesterday, was perfect weather round the back of herm with the biscuit! Feeling it in my arms today though!!
Just noticed you are thinking of an engine change! Whats the score with your 300? May be interested if it was comming up for sale... or would it be a very bad idea on the back of an R21??
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29-09-2008, 12:50 PM
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#8
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Registered User
Country: Scotland
Location: Kirkcudbright
Interests: Boats n Lambrettas
Boat make: Boatless
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Kirkcudbright
Posts: 978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larby
thats tempting but...
I doubt i'll get a pair of 2.5's for the same kinda price as a 300x and a gorilla lifter
JF himself said the he sh*t his pants at that kinda speed so xr2's should do me fine
Ideal motors for me would be a pair of 2.5 carb motors, doubt i'll get them either tho!
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Taz had a pair of XR2's for sale not long ago.
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29-09-2008, 08:30 PM
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#9
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Registered User
Country: Guernsey
Occupation: Engineering
Boat make: None, boo!
Engines: Turbines mainly!
Cruising area: The inside of my workshop!
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,646
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Mike, I'm in discussion with taz at the moment, hoping to strike a deal there... he's away at the mo.
Andy, PM me your mobile number, i'm sure many on here would agree the ring would be more than capable of taking the 300, and it's got the right length leg too!
Cheers, James
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14-10-2008, 06:11 AM
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#10
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Registered User
Country: US
Location: Daytona Beach, Florida
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Daytona Beach, Florida
Posts: 8
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I have a pair of 2005 Merc 15" 280 ROS motor with fresh rebuilds for $26,000 US dollars for both, and a pair of 1999 300 Promaxs, $18,000 for the pair.
__________________
Check out my Liberator and Checkmate Boats website: https://liberatorfl.tripod.com
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14-10-2008, 07:35 AM
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#11
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Registered User
Country: Guernsey
Occupation: Engineering
Boat make: None, boo!
Engines: Turbines mainly!
Cruising area: The inside of my workshop!
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,646
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Both of which I'd sell my gran for, but could still never afford
Cheers for the offer though, had seen them on S&F too...
James
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14-10-2008, 09:12 AM
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#12
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Registered User
Country: England
Location: Birmingham
Occupation: Scratching
Interests: Big Dinners
Boat name: Never Enough
Boat make: Seaquel 600xs
Engines: 225hp Merc ProMax
Cruising area: Anywhere! I prefer Weymouth
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 3,232
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Xr2's are more than likely going to push your puma way past a speed your able to comfortably maintain plus they are light and they are the engine I think the boat was designed for and dont mention the fact there are 1 million Xr2's for sale in the UK and finding a pair for 4k-5k or even less isnt going to be a problem.
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I got jumper cables!
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14-10-2008, 05:16 PM
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#13
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Registered User
Country: Guernsey
Occupation: Engineering
Boat make: None, boo!
Engines: Turbines mainly!
Cruising area: The inside of my workshop!
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,646
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I've got my eye on a pair of Yam 225's at the mo that i can get a really, really good deal on. I know they're heavier but the extra power should make up for that. I'd personally trust the reliability of the yams more than xr2's, especially seeing as they've only done very few hours.
Main deciding factor is the price though, £5k is way too much, especially considering i need to still buy steering, and get the engines shipped... The yams are local
James
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14-10-2008, 06:14 PM
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#14
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Engine tester
Country: united kingdom
Location: Southend on Sea
Occupation: Construction
Interests: Gin & Women
Boat name: motorvator
Boat make: Revenger San Marino / Sunseeker Camargue 46 / Phantom 18/19/600
Engines: 502 mercruiser / Detroit 550s / 115 ProXS / Anything Borrowed
Cruising area: Thames, Southend
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Southend on Sea
Posts: 1,021
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larby
Both of which I'd sell my gran for, but could still never afford
Cheers for the offer though, had seen them on S&F too...
James
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Tell us more about this gran. Is she fit?
__________________
"Lend us a motor Chaos"
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14-10-2008, 08:22 PM
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#15
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Registered User
Country: England
Location: Hampshire
Occupation: Credit Crunched
Interests: Rally Driving
Boat name: Double 2 Shirts
Boat make: Planatec 41
Engines: 2x625's+ From Uncle Sam
Cruising area: Solent
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 2,522
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motorvator
Tell us more about this gran. Is she fit?
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You "OLD CHARMER" Is that a pair of 225 yams in your pocket or has your Truss Slipped - Again
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14-10-2008, 09:15 PM
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#16
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Registered User
Country: England
Location: Birmingham
Occupation: Scratching
Interests: Big Dinners
Boat name: Never Enough
Boat make: Seaquel 600xs
Engines: 225hp Merc ProMax
Cruising area: Anywhere! I prefer Weymouth
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 3,232
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I was taking to someone about this boat at drivers. And I think weight is an issue. The extra weight of the yams my not be the best way to go.
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I got jumper cables!
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14-10-2008, 09:36 PM
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#17
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Registered User
Occupation: Champion Pie Eater
Boat name: On The Rocks
Boat make: Ring 21 marshan 17 four winns horizon, hydro 3 pointer, f2 cat, backdraft 22
Cruising area: Way up norf and Sarf coast areas
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,619
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I'm sure the Yams are about 245 Kg each and the Mercs are 193kg def.
104kg's extra for the pair, would the 2.5 Merc's EFI's not put more load on the transom because of the higher power although weighing less?
Mr Rob, What do you think?
gaZ
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15-10-2008, 09:00 AM
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#18
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Registered User
Country: Guernsey
Occupation: Engineering
Boat make: None, boo!
Engines: Turbines mainly!
Cruising area: The inside of my workshop!
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motorvator
Tell us more about this gran. Is she fit?
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Nah, she gets out of breath just walking across the lounge....
That is what you meant isn't it??
Quote:
Originally Posted by gazza
I'm sure the Yams are about 245 Kg each and the Mercs are 193kg def.
104kg's extra for the pair, would the 2.5 Merc's EFI's not put more load on the transom because of the higher power although weighing less?
Mr Rob, What do you think?
gaZ
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Cheers for all the feedback guys, I'd rather go through it all now than after i've bought a pair!
Steve H mentioned that she could easily be upset by too much weight in the back as she was built so light... That said, so far i've removed over 150kg of 2x4 and other assorted kinds of wood, including 2 fence posts from the back which should help with that!
She also had the fuel tanks moved forwards to balance her when she did the 111mph run, so this should help with balance for the heavier motors?
What would be the effects of her being a little stern heavy? Is there anything else i can do to counteract this?
Cheers, James
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15-10-2008, 11:28 AM
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#19
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Registered User
Country: uk
Location: poole
Occupation: retail
Interests: sport and being lazy
Boat make: ring rib
Engines: merc xr2
Cruising area: bournemouth bay
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: poole
Posts: 1,681
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gazza
I'm sure the Yams are about 245 Kg each and the Mercs are 193kg def.
gaZ
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Over the years I had collect a few Merc XR2 pamphlets showing their spec sheets and they showed weight at 159KG considerably lighter than Yams
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i can na give her any more captain
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15-10-2008, 08:08 PM
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#20
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Registered User
Occupation: Champion Pie Eater
Boat name: On The Rocks
Boat make: Ring 21 marshan 17 four winns horizon, hydro 3 pointer, f2 cat, backdraft 22
Cruising area: Way up norf and Sarf coast areas
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,619
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I was only going on a 2.4 merc 200 weight.
2.5 EFI 170kg
2.5 200 179kg
gaZ
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