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Old 16-02-2012, 04:55 PM   #21
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When's the 2012 PB1 gonna be published?
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Old 16-02-2012, 05:02 PM   #22
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2013
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Old 16-02-2012, 05:09 PM   #23
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2013


It would be nice to have it with enough time to prepare a boat....
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Old 16-02-2012, 05:44 PM   #24
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And, have we got it yet?
My new boat (even though ordered last year) has side impact protection !! and I am just leaving to collect it, also going to Belgian Boat Show tomorrow !!

Bob
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Old 16-02-2012, 05:50 PM   #25
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My new boat (even though ordered last year) has side impact protection !! and I am just leaving to collect it, also going to Belgian Boat Show tomorrow !!

Bob
[/QUOTE]
III. A Class finished hull and deck inc UK delivery £8,000 excl VAT
IV. B Class finished hull and deck inc UK delivery £6,000 excl VAT

[/QUOTE]

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Old 17-02-2012, 08:11 AM   #26
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And, have we got it yet?
Nothing I am allowed to share yet but we are very close indeed!
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Old 17-02-2012, 09:00 AM   #27
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Side Impact Protection

Side Impact Protection is now defined, final drawings being prepared, stand by!
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Old 17-02-2012, 10:44 AM   #28
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just a quick question is this a rya or uim thing? i mean is this for uk national racing and only governing our boats?
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Old 17-02-2012, 12:13 PM   #29
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just a quick question is this a rya or uim thing? i mean is this for uk national racing and only governing our boats?
As far as I'm aware it only really concerns OCR and similar which are National classes.
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Old 17-02-2012, 12:38 PM   #30
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According to the RYA minutes.....

4. Class 3B,The ORC agreed:

1. Additional buoyancy would be required as from 1 January 2012; additional
buoyancy to be provided under bow, deck and close to transom of boat.
Adam Younger to provide detailed specification.

Action: Adam Younger/Offshore Technical
Side impact protection is highly recommended for existing boats from 1 January 2012 and mandatory for new builds as from the same date.
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Old 17-02-2012, 12:52 PM   #31
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Quote:
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As far as I'm aware it only really concerns OCR and similar which are National classes.
that was my understanding. thanks john. but if its 3b or any foreign boats come over to race what happens then? what if the uk hosts an international event? foreign boats will not comply to uk specs?
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Old 17-02-2012, 06:29 PM   #32
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Modifying an existing boat

Having stripped my P19 to the bare bones,would filling the side box sections where the cables and wiring currently run with expanded foam not offer more side protection.is this the type of modification that is being proposed,I say this as most car front bumpers have an element of foam type material to obsorb impacts.
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Old 18-02-2012, 07:30 AM   #33
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Nic, I probably wouldn't go down that route, expanding foam is open cell and will therefore absorb water. The type of impact protection looked at is more about a couple of layers of Kevlar inside to help stop penetration and increase strength around the driver. Keeping seats as low as possible and maybe adding a canopy over the rear seats (as per Honda 225 boats for example) would help stop any side impact from hitting the occupants.
That's how I understand it at least.

Probably worth hanging out for Adam's proper spec if you can though I must admit I feel the RYA are about a year and two months late making major changes for this season!

Cheers, James
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Old 18-02-2012, 09:27 AM   #34
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Quote:
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Having stripped my P19 to the bare bones,would filling the side box sections where the cables and wiring currently run with expanded foam not offer more side protection.is this the type of modification that is being proposed,I say this as most car front bumpers have an element of foam type material to obsorb impacts.
As far as I understand there will be no requirement to modify existing boats, as Larby says be careful what you add in there as open cell foams will suck up water! If you want to do something sit as low as you can in the boat and still see where you're going, not only will it be safer but you will be lowering the centre of gravity!
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Old 18-02-2012, 09:34 AM   #35
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I'm a little confused now, as I was led to believe that one of the "improvements" was going to be boxing in the coamings, then filling them in with foam.
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Old 18-02-2012, 01:47 PM   #36
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I've not tried it

Quote:
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Nic, I probably wouldn't go down that route, expanding foam is open cell and will therefore absorb water. The type of impact protection looked at is more about a couple of layers of Kevlar inside to help stop penetration and increase strength around the driver. Keeping seats as low as possible and maybe adding a canopy over the rear seats (as per Honda 225 boats for example) would help stop any side impact from hitting the occupants.
That's how I understand it at least.

Probably worth hanging out for Adam's proper spec if you can though I must admit I feel the RYA are about a year and two months late making major changes for this season!

Cheers, James
Hi James.I'm confused by your comments about expanded foam,is this not what is pumped into cavity walls ? I know its put there as an insulation but if it obsorbs water that much would it not cause damp problems in walls-filling the cavity goes against why you build with a cavity in the first place.,my only boat experience of this was an old Fletcher that seemed to have all the boxed in parts filled with foam but I never put the boat in the water to see what happened when wet saying that the floor was quite rotten but this could have been from water on top.Would fitting the latest style rally seats be a solution the ones with the sides around the head-although it would make the navigators job difficult.also might make exiting the boat in a flip harder with something else to tangle with.
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Old 18-02-2012, 08:46 PM   #37
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The outer 'crust' of expanding foam is fairly waterproof, so in building use where this is left intact water absorbtion isn't an issue.
That said, the foam structure itself is open cell and therefore when water is able to get past the 'crust', it will be absorbed like a sponge.

Two part closed cell expanding foam is available, such as used to fill around fuel tanks on boats and such. Although the cell structure won't allow it to actually absorb water, it can still become waterlogged, as you found out with the fletcher.

To some extent, foam will help to add strength by supporting the glass alongside it. Back when I was into cars with horrendous bodykits, it was a common trick to backfill the splitter with foam to stop the fibreglass bumper from cracking when hit on speedbumps etc.
Foam of sorts is also used in modern car bumpers to 'dull' or absorb impacts, but bear in mind we're talking about blunt objects striking each other. The foam doesn't halp stop anything being penentrated, it just softens the impact by spreading the force of the impact out over a longer time, thus reducing the severity of the forces felt. Much the same as it hurts less to punch a pillow than a hard wall.

When we're talking about the sharp nose of a boat or a prop though, foam will do little. It probably would help the coaming (that boxed in part) survive if a boat rode over the top, but so would some kevlar, which would also resist puncturing or fracturing.

There would be no point fitting the seats with the big head restraints. They would do nothing in the event of an accident as the helmet restraints simply aren't designed to resist an impact. Having just turned a bare, lightweight P20 upside down it reminds you just how much they weigh. Imagine hitting one against one of those seats at 70mph and you can imagine how little it will do!
Add to that the reduced visibility and you're probably more likely to have an accident as you may not be as aware of what's going on around you.

You'd be best to simply go with the advice given by Cookee. Keep the seats and therefore yourself as low as possible (so it doesn't reduce your view) so you're protected by the sides and can duck below them.
Enclose the boat around you as much as possible. Phantom made covers designed for this, I have a set and have a mould for the rear cowl. That would allow a boat to ride over the top much easier and could have a raised section as per the 225 hondas which would act, if supported properly, like a fibreglass roll-over hoop to deflect any boat clean over the top of you.

Finally and probably most importantly, get some good training. Learn how to avoid hooks etc and what to do if it happens. Also, what to do if it happens to someone right in front of you. You wouldn't fit a car with a roll cage because you can't be bothered to learn to drive, you'd get lessons so you never end up needing the roll cage!

All just my thoughts of course!

James
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Old 19-02-2012, 08:54 AM   #38
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Quote:
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All just my thoughts of course!

James
For the record I would agree with everything Larby said above.
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Old 19-02-2012, 12:03 PM   #39
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Training

Purely out of interest here, what type of training are you talking about here (not the standard rya stuff I presume)? Just wondering how many of the current racers have undergone such training (vs those that have just built up experience) and is this is something both of you have undertaken?
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Old 19-02-2012, 06:58 PM   #40
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I believe it very much should form a part of the RYA training schedule, as I feel this is currently very lapse. We've done training in Guernsey since before I was born and as our training officer I'm looking to keep up these standards!
It will definately be a part of the syllabus next year and I intend to go over it with all current racers.

It's not something I've done as it wasn't a part of things when I started and I've got limited driving experience. When it comes to training I rely on the experience of others to ensure we offer a full package to our racers. Just because I've put a lot of time and effort into learning the theory doesn't mean to say I know it all, that's better left to those who have done it for years, we can all learn from each other!

I doubt many racers have been through this type of training as it isn't currently mandtory. I'd imagine it's the kind of thing covered by the likes of Neil Holmes or similar, and I believe P1 racers have to do training with him before racing.

I'm all for making racing as accessable as possible, but I do believe racers should go through a much more concise training syllabus before heading out there, it's a dangerous sport after all.

James
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