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14-07-2008, 09:05 PM
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#41
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Large member
Country: England
Location: On the farm
Occupation: General Trouble Causer Salterns Boatyard
Interests: Official smartass
Boat name: Seahorse.org
Boat make: a V24 and a SLOW unstable ICE Bladerunner
Engines: 2x300 promax, 320 Volvo
Cruising area: England/France & Med
Join Date: May 2005
Location: On the farm
Posts: 2,681
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin The Talker
If anyone actually belives the silly rubbish being posted on this forum by certain persons.
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Marc. My name is Marc. You know my name, I know your name, lets actually USE our names and not spread confusing remarks about 'unknown persons'...
( yes - I know you have a small side show for those 'lesser' boats which are not capable of going to sea - that is not the point - the point is the real show - the Cowes Torquay Cowes race.)
Yes, I am of the opinion that *if* the CTC committee decide to ban the V24's from the CTC, then this would set a precident that all future organisers will follow, and that *your* decision is a critical turning point in the future of V24's in 'proper' offshore racing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin The Talker
Please, those of you who are actually racing V24 boats this year, do not allow yourselves to get swayed by these persons.
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See why it is so important you actually name the people you are going to moan about : Reviewing the posts here I can see posts by myself and by Lance Selby. Lance *actually* is racing a V24 boat this year, and I have *actually* entered and paid my entry fee and done the dunk tests and medical required - so it is confusing as it appears you are talking about either Lance or myself - yet *both* either are already racing, or have paid to race, and your comment gets confusing.
Finally - it confuses everybody if you take something from a Private Message or an Emali, and post as if it were part of the thread. The others on the forum dont get to read your email nor your PM's so get confused about your postings.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin The Talker
The 'silly season' is obviously in full swing - wait for the facts, not juvenile games being played by those with nothing better to do !
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Yes it is. Who is the idiot who ruined our day by announcing that the V24's were not going to be allowed to race the CTC before any such decision had been made? The entry form clearly show a class for V24, The P1 guys clearly said that V24's were allowed to enter, and we were happy and content.
Who has nothing better to do than play juvenile games and leak the 'information' that V24's can not do the CTC? I get it - that is the person you are referring to, and I misunderstood that you were referring to me. See how important it is to name the person you are responding to?
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14-07-2008, 09:11 PM
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#42
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,374
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There appears to be so much testosterone on this thread
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14-07-2008, 09:17 PM
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#43
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blind dog
Country: uk
Location: fast land
Occupation: going fast
Interests: fast
Boat name: drivers dry berthing
Boat make: buzzi
Cruising area: anywhere fast
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: fast land
Posts: 828
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ctc
small side show for lesser boats not capable of going to sea. nice
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14-07-2008, 09:24 PM
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#44
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Senior Member
Country: UK
Location: Hampshire
Interests: Powerboats,Commentating, Bikes
Boat make: None at the moment
Cruising area: Wherever I can get a ride !
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 690
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CTC Race - Late entries
Regarding LATE ENTRIES In the CTC Race event.
I have had confirmation that Powerboat P1 WILL accept late entries, after the official closing date (This Friday, 18th July), however, there may well be a premium to be added to the entry fee, for such late entries.
Hope this helps.
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14-07-2008, 09:27 PM
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#45
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blind dog
Country: uk
Location: fast land
Occupation: going fast
Interests: fast
Boat name: drivers dry berthing
Boat make: buzzi
Cruising area: anywhere fast
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: fast land
Posts: 828
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ctc
thanks for finding out ,il,e wait to see the details for the lesser boats
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14-07-2008, 09:38 PM
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#46
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,374
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin The Talker
Regarding LATE ENTRIES In the CTC Race event.
I have had confirmation that Powerboat P1 WILL accept late entries, after the official closing date (This Friday, 18th July), however, there may well be a premium to be added to the entry fee, for such late entries.
Hope this helps.
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I thought they wanted as many boats as possible to take part.
I still don't understand the entry fee structure. My 10m rib is smaller than some RB3 boats yet the fee is nearly 3 times as much. Ok i have larger engines and i don't mind paying more, but 3 times
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14-07-2008, 09:52 PM
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#47
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Large member
Country: England
Location: On the farm
Occupation: General Trouble Causer Salterns Boatyard
Interests: Official smartass
Boat name: Seahorse.org
Boat make: a V24 and a SLOW unstable ICE Bladerunner
Engines: 2x300 promax, 320 Volvo
Cruising area: England/France & Med
Join Date: May 2005
Location: On the farm
Posts: 2,681
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blind dog
small side show for lesser boats not capable of going to sea. nice
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Exactly my point!!!
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15-07-2008, 09:30 AM
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#48
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Registered User
Location: hayling island
Boat name: snow monkey
Boat make: extreme 24
Engines: mercruiser 6.2
Join Date: May 2004
Location: hayling island
Posts: 2,082
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blind dog
thanks for finding out ,il,e wait to see the details for the lesser boats
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that goes for me to
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15-07-2008, 10:37 AM
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#49
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Large member
Country: England
Location: On the farm
Occupation: General Trouble Causer Salterns Boatyard
Interests: Official smartass
Boat name: Seahorse.org
Boat make: a V24 and a SLOW unstable ICE Bladerunner
Engines: 2x300 promax, 320 Volvo
Cruising area: England/France & Med
Join Date: May 2005
Location: On the farm
Posts: 2,681
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl
that goes for me to
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You just dont get it
You guys have the option of doing the CTC, but can choose to do the Pool race.
You have 'real boats' that can drive in the sea.
The post was sarchasm regarding the V24.
You are getting American!
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15-07-2008, 11:05 AM
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#50
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Registered User
Location: hayling island
Boat name: snow monkey
Boat make: extreme 24
Engines: mercruiser 6.2
Join Date: May 2004
Location: hayling island
Posts: 2,082
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i do get it i can assure you of that. yes my boat will do the ctc,but i would prefer to do the poole race,because the costs should be alot less i hope, thats if i bother at all,because there are no details about it,i might just do safety and watch everyone else which is much more relaxing
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15-07-2008, 11:36 AM
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#51
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Large member
Country: England
Location: On the farm
Occupation: General Trouble Causer Salterns Boatyard
Interests: Official smartass
Boat name: Seahorse.org
Boat make: a V24 and a SLOW unstable ICE Bladerunner
Engines: 2x300 promax, 320 Volvo
Cruising area: England/France & Med
Join Date: May 2005
Location: On the farm
Posts: 2,681
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Cool.
I dont want you thinking I am saying you have a 'lesser boat' if you do the Pool run - that is your choice. I want to do the CTC as I have been working towards that for the past 3 months. All boat repairs and the new engine were all 'deadlined' for the CTC.
My sarcasm - using 'lesser boats' is a dig at the people who are trying to say that we should not be allowed to do the CTC for our own safety.
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15-07-2008, 11:43 AM
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#52
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Registered User
Location: hayling island
Boat name: snow monkey
Boat make: extreme 24
Engines: mercruiser 6.2
Join Date: May 2004
Location: hayling island
Posts: 2,082
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no worries ,i knew what you meant.
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15-07-2008, 09:55 PM
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#53
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Registered User
Country: south coast
Location: brighton
Interests: boatin
Boat name: Hey Jude
Boat make: Phantom
Engines: 200 xs
Cruising area: solent
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: brighton
Posts: 44
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ctc
sorry i am confused, please help.
Are they saying that if a canopied boat turns over they do not have sufficient safety cover? if so that should mean no canopies at all surely.
Or are they saying they are racing under RB08 rules, which didnt allow canopies. Frankly i dont see what RB08 has to do with CTC.
It seems to me that the UIM want more classes to be canopied ie class 3-2l to make them safer but the organisers dont want canopies.
Im sure you sign a disclaimer anyway when you race in a canopy
How many safety boats, with divers, do you see when you race round the IOW.
Your thoughts / comments please.
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15-07-2008, 11:22 PM
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#54
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,891
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Unfortunately you can't disclaimer your life away.
Nevertheless, a risk assessment of canopied boats should identify that the risks of a canopied boat are lower - otherwise what's the point of having em!
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15-07-2008, 11:35 PM
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#55
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Large member
Country: England
Location: On the farm
Occupation: General Trouble Causer Salterns Boatyard
Interests: Official smartass
Boat name: Seahorse.org
Boat make: a V24 and a SLOW unstable ICE Bladerunner
Engines: 2x300 promax, 320 Volvo
Cruising area: England/France & Med
Join Date: May 2005
Location: On the farm
Posts: 2,681
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There is a flaw in the thinking of some people.
They are under the impression - and can not be convinced otherwise - that if a canopied boat turns over then it is a requirement for a diver to go in and rescue them.
In Class3 C, with rather dodgy canopies, both instances I am aware of of a cat with a canopy going over did not receive assistance from divers and all crew extricated.
With V24 - in four cases since 2002 of a boat flipping over - no diver came to assist. In one instance a diver approached, and decided not to get wet. In all these cases the crew saved themselves without diver assistance.
This does not change when you are in Lyme Bay. There are no divers at the circut races anyway - on non at the crash site who get involved - what has changed?
There is a very good argument that the canopied boats are actually safer on a balance of probabilities. The incidence always refferred to - that teh crew are knocked unconcious due to the impact of the collision has a very low probability to balance against the very high risk - yet you have to assume a very high probability of death or serious injury if you were not in a canopied boat and suffered the same collision.
Health and safety risk assessment may in fact show that organisers are actually endangering the lives of competitors by insisting they do not run with canopies. They are enforcing less safe practices, increasing the risk of injury to competitors.
It is like making a ruling that airbags should be removed from all cars, cause you dont like them and because you did not have them when you were young.....
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15-07-2008, 11:41 PM
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#56
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Large member
Country: England
Location: On the farm
Occupation: General Trouble Causer Salterns Boatyard
Interests: Official smartass
Boat name: Seahorse.org
Boat make: a V24 and a SLOW unstable ICE Bladerunner
Engines: 2x300 promax, 320 Volvo
Cruising area: England/France & Med
Join Date: May 2005
Location: On the farm
Posts: 2,681
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel Dodger
Im sure you sign a disclaimer anyway when you race in a canopy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt
Unfortunately you can't disclaimer your life away.
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You can not 'disclaimer your life away'.
You can however sign a form which states that you are aware of the safety cover provided by the organisers of the event, and that in YOUR opinion you are safer running in a canopied boat than running in an open boat. This states you have evaluated the situation and have made a decision to run with what you think is the safer option.
There - an Adult solution to this silly problem.
As an adult in my right mind, I have evaluated the risks of running with a canopied boat given the specific rescue cover that the organisers have made me aware of, and I have decided that I am safer in a canopied boat should an accident occur, and I believe I am safer to run in a canopied boat for this event.
( give that to a lawyer to make it a page long and *bingo* no more issues with canopied boat racing!!!)
Where is Pash1 when you need him.
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16-07-2008, 12:08 AM
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#57
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Registered User
Country: UK
Location: Bucks
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Bucks
Posts: 586
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Quote:
Originally Posted by verytricky
There is a very good argument that the canopied boats are actually safer on a balance of probabilities. The incidence always referred to - that the crew are knocked unconscious due to the impact of the collision has a very low probability to balance against the very high risk - yet you have to assume a very high probability of death or serious injury if you were not in a canopied boat and suffered the same collision.
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On this point I totally agree, since the Mark Lavin Memorial Safety Foundation was set up, I find it crazy that boats that run over 70 mph are allowed to run without canopies.
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16-07-2008, 12:38 PM
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#58
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Large member
Country: England
Location: On the farm
Occupation: General Trouble Causer Salterns Boatyard
Interests: Official smartass
Boat name: Seahorse.org
Boat make: a V24 and a SLOW unstable ICE Bladerunner
Engines: 2x300 promax, 320 Volvo
Cruising area: England/France & Med
Join Date: May 2005
Location: On the farm
Posts: 2,681
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I would like to put together a risk analysis sheet on canopy vs non canopy for offshore races.
The people who make decision thesedays understand risk analysis matricies better than any of the more obvious methods of presentation.
Anyone able to assist?
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16-07-2008, 01:01 PM
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#59
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Registered User
Location: West Coast of Norway
Occupation: naval architect
Interests: surface piercing props, stepped hulls, air entrapment hulls
Boat name: none
Boat make: PetterTintorera
Engines: Yamaha 90
Cruising area: West Coast of Norway
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: West Coast of Norway
Posts: 888
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...might be easier to get hold of some statistical data?
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