Rotating in or rotating out?

[verytricky]

And depth of prop..

So that is two questions....

( This is a Blade Runner )


I was told my setup was wrong on the weekend. My LHP turns clockwise, my RHP turns anti. So they turn 'IN' and could with the paddlewheel effect suck the boat into the water. Is this correct? Should theis be different?

Then...
The engines seem high? They could be several inches lower. On the V24 the prop is very low in the water. If I moved the engine lower, would that help top end speed?


Do you have to remove the engines to swap the drive direction, or can you just change the bottom case?


Can you get longer case shafts? ( promax 300 )


Oops - that is 4 questions...

 

[MrRob]

I can see how having your props rotate in this way could cause a suction effect. All duel engine setups I have seen do have them setup the other way round, I guess there is a reason for it. Its easy enough to swap the gear boxes over to switch them around. A job you could do yourself! The higher you have your engine up the greater top end you will get. You just need to watch the revs and keep an eye on the water pressure to make sure your picking up engine cooling water. If you have your engine lower in you will get better take off but lose top end speed. You can get longer shafts (midsections). I think you can get between 15" and 25" shafts but I think in the USA you can get spacers also. You could invest in CNC power lifts for your engines but I dont know what the transom of your boat is like but if you can get outboards on there then you should be able to get power lifts on there.

I have seen the pics of what I think is your blade runner from the driverswarf poker run?Beautiful boat mate! I would love a passenger ride in it one day! What kinds of speeds u getting? About 100mph+ I should guess?

Rob.

 

[Tony Davis]

About 100mph+ I should guess?

Rob. [/B]

Guess again!

 

[Matt]

1) Try it and see which you like best

2) Does she get on the plane and accelerate OK? Lower motors will not increase your ultimate top speed, it'll lower it.

3) No, just the gearboxes, takes only a few minutes. BUT you need enough space under the engines to drop the boxes, including drive shafts. DO NOT just swap the props and run the boxes in reverse, unless you want to buy new boxes. If taz tells you otherwise, ignore him.

4) Why would you want them?

 

[Gavin Brown]

Its easy enough to swap the gear boxes over to switch them around. A job you could do yourself!
/B]

Quite clearly you've never met

 

[Captain Chaos]

wouldnt ice marine themselves be able to help with this one?

surely they must have had some experience with how the motorrs run best

 

[Gavin Brown]

Not sure if they would be willing to assist MR TRICKY after the last time.

 

[John G]

Yes - I know that the guys at Ice would be more than happy to help with this or any other enquiry you have about your Bladerunner.

Running correctly it should walk away from yr V24 and in the rough there would be absolutely no contest!

 

[Jon Fuller]

Running correctly it should walk away from yr V24 and in the rough there would be absolutely no contest!

I wouldn't be so sure about that. I reckon you'd have more chance of ending up wearing the Bladerunner as a hat, than in the V-24

 

[John G]

You have to experience it to believe it - the website hype really ain't bullsh*t.

In a head sea it just refuses to lift its nose and stays dead level when it does fly. You have a hard job to stuff one (unlike a V-24!) due to it's v.low deadrise bow section and obviously the outer hulls keep it stable and nearly impossible to hook.

As far as the capsize incedents - basically just pretty dam unlucky esp on first outing! What boat won't capsize when pushed real hard - cert not a BatBoat!

IMHO the forgivingness(?) of the hull encourages you to push it harder than you would normally and therefore closer to the edge.

 

[PHANTOM EVOLUTION]

rotate

turning the props inwards should be faster but you lose handling , if the engines are to high you lose drive and speed and the boat will runalong with the bow to low,

 

[verytricky]

Originally posted by Gavin Brown
Quite clearly you've never met

Quite clearly I have been too 'offhands' with the care of my boats, relying too much on others to fix and sort it, paying the bill at the end of the day and jumping into a boat supposedly sorted.

Starting with the V24 I am getting more 'hands on' doing most of the preperation work myself. I believe I am capable of performing an oil and fuel filter change ( the V24 has TWO fuel filters! ) changing the impellors, clearing out the bilge filters, fixing the trim switches so they dont stop working mid race, and protecting the battery from seawater with a cover - all should be possible, even for me.

I have already worked on a new set of race props that are better than last years set.

On the blade runner I want to work the props, change the engine cover to get more air into the engines and some work so that the engines dont grind on the cowling during running...

 

[Jon Fuller]

You have to experience it to believe it - the website hype really ain't bullsh*t.

In a head sea it just refuses to lift its nose and stays dead level when it does fly. You have a hard job to stuff one (unlike a V-24!) due to it's v.low deadrise bow section and obviously the outer hulls keep it stable and nearly impossible to hook.

As far as the capsize incedents - basically just pretty dam unlucky esp on first outing! What boat won't capsize when pushed real hard - cert not a BatBoat!

IMHO the forgivingness(?) of the hull encourages you to push it harder than you would normally and therefore closer to the edge.

That all sounds very good, but quite clearly Marc 'had a few over the front' on saturday, and they've achieved little or no success in racing.

When Tony Jenvey turned it over on it's maiden race outing in Poole, he wasn't actually racing anyone, as he was the only boat in class, and when it went over the second time, it was during a charter trip! so I remain unconvinced with this particular creation from Lorne, although it does look gorgeous.

 

[verytricky]

What kinds of speeds u getting? About 100mph+ I should guess?

Rob.

The race version with race engines got 105mph as a record. So the 'luxury version' would not quite get there.

The production version is about 2x the weight, due to the material used, and as it is open topped, there is additional material for support.

The boat at rest sits about 2 inches lower in the water than the race boat.


So the best I have on GPS is 84mph This is with the engines at 5100 rpm. They just will not go faster. There appears to be some form of air starvation. The engines themselves will easily rev to 6500 with no load, so they can get there.

This weekend I will try adding on some plywood airscoops to force more air into the engine bay. So lookout for an ugly blade runner out in Southampton waters.

Plus I will be working the props, and trying a new prop design with 4 blades that are new on the market ( supposedly rated for 100mph + )

 

[verytricky]

That all sounds very good, but quite clearly Marc 'had a few over the front' on saturday, and they've achieved little or no sucess in racing.

When Tony J turned it over on it's maiden race outing in Poole, he wasn't actually racing anyone, as he was the only boat in class, and when it went over the second time, it was during a charter trip! so I remain unconvinced with this particular creation from Lorne, although it does look gorgeous.

You cant seem to lift the bow, no matter what you do. You cant lower the bow either! It seems to move an inch or two, no matter what you do with the trim! You can get a loverly rooster tail!

It is very very stable on a flat line, or with head on wash. But wash coming from the side - anything more than 45 degrees scares the shyte out of you. The wash side sponson first goes up in the air. then gravity and the lack of wave makes that side drop into the 'hole' just as the opposing sponson hits the wash crest. the arse end flips about violently!

At the same time the nose tries to burry itself in the sea.

The difference between handling the conditions and not is only about 5mph. I can confidently take sideways wash at the 70 - 75 mph mark, but can not handle the same wash at the 75 to 80 mph mark. So you can go almost flatout in the rough - you just need to have glasses and a rain suit.

Jeans and 'T's are not suitable attaire for anything other than a V24 with a canopy.


One good thing: Mrs Verytricky was intending to buy a Honda for next year, as she liked the open top and the wind in her hair type racing. - getting a face full of sea every few minutes, along with the loverly video's of the open topped racers getting flung from their boats in accidents, or hitting the waves head on in a stuff, convinced her that inside a canopy was where she belonged.

**The only real problem now is she wants to do ProVee, because they go to nicer places. She prefered the European locations we went to last year over the Rough Races we had in the UK.... Anyone have a ProVee they want to sell?

 

[verytricky]

1) Try it and see which you like best

2) Does she get on the plane and accelerate OK? Lower motors will not increase your ultimate top speed, it'll lower it.

3) No, just the gearboxes, takes only a few minutes. BUT you need enough space under the engines to drop the boxes, including drive shafts. DO NOT just swap the props and run the boxes in reverse, unless you want to buy new boxes. If taz tells you otherwise, ignore him.

4) Why would you want them?

Thank you.
Any more detail on the 'box swap' - I may attemp this this weekend!

 

[PHANTOM EVOLUTION]

RPM

an engine at 6500 with no load may throw a rod out ,having said that i think an engine with a rod out the block may still get to 6500 rpm

 

[verytricky]

I wouldn't be so sure about that. I reckon you'd have more chance of ending up wearing the Bladerunner as a hat, than in the V-24

I am quite confident that in the rough the V24 will eat the Blade Runner. The V24 top speed is the same - rough or not. The V24 is very forgiving, and will respond to input very quickly, and is repeatable in its reaction to events, building confidence quickly!

Also, unless the Blade Runner is well setup, it will not go above about 75mph.

Jeremy was attempting to sell 'Flamenco' with 300 promax's showing a client the boat in the solent, and both up and down, we could catch and pass the Blade Runner in the V24. We topped out at 77mph on the GPS that trip, and I would guess we were 3 to 4 MPH faster. Additionally, several months later, Dylan ( who was interested in buying the boat ) measured the top speed of 'Flamenco' with a hand held GPS with Jeremy driving, and got 72 mph in the Solent. ( weekday trip, not much interferance from waves or other craft. )

 

[verytricky]

Re: RPM

an engine at 6500 with no load may throw a rod out ,having said that i think an engine with a rod out the block may still get to 6500 rpm

So I will not do that again. I wanted to see if there was some engine limit on the revs, as it quite clearly locks up at 5100 rpm, almost like it was a limit switch!

I will report back with the results after adding modified air scoops this weekend.

 

[Gavin Brown]

Marc if you would like to increase your budget so you can run to the full maintance scheam then we won't have to rely on your kind self having to get your I.T. hand's dirty.

V-24 mod's approved????????????????D.Q.


Pay's yer money takes yer choice and it seems you have,from all at BBMS we wish you good luck with the rest of the season.

P.S the boat can leave once you've settled your overdue account.