Cowes 2010 update

[motorvator]

Originally Posted by Jon Fuller

Kerry, a British Power Boat Racing Association would most likely consist of the current ORC members, as they are basically the club reps from the various UK clubs as things stand.

For such an organisation to be formed, and actually work, in that it could replace the RYA, it would have to be handed over by the RYA and have their blessing, otherwise all the difficulties of approaching coast guards, harbour masters etc as a non affiliated org would still exist.

Whether the RYA would consider such a blessing (they might just consider it a blessing to 'them', who knows) we can't tell.

My own opinion is that 75% of what the PB1 consists of presently, should be thrown out, and anything rules wise that could / would be covered by existing UIM terms, should be used, thus simplifying the UK rules. by this, I mean things like the overtaking rule. if its good enough for the Union International Motornautiqe, I don't understand why we would try to alter it, and indeed, take on the responsibility if an accident occured and some smart arse lawyer tried to blame it on the non international methods used here.
then, the only exception should be class clasification for UK only classes such as OCR, and maybe Marathon (running Marathon back as originally intended, at let the 'others nations' run to the altered rules if they so wish, or indeed have the competitors to run races)

Sorry Jon, I misread your post and stuck a d in it as in drivers association

You're right that there are benefits of affiliation with RYA as they are seen as 'the' body from coastguards HMs etc and I'm not sure how you would stand with insurance matters without them to start with.

It seems to me though that the place to start is to get the Marathon entries speaking as one voice i.e. drivers association so that your representation is made as one body to RYA, UIM etc.

At the moment they are changing rules without consultation with the actual people who race from what I can see. You would be a powerful voice if consolidated into an organisation as even the RYA can see there is little point adjusting rules without discussion from the team owners persective.

[Jon Fuller]

To be perfectly honest, I think asking teams, or builders, or suppliers to sit on a committee would be disasterous, or as Barrie Williams would say, a mad womans breakfast.

You'd end up with 30 odd 'Fabio Buzzi's' each arguing why they should be allowed to run this engine, or that drive, or make this mod. would be ferkin crazy. the decision makers need to be a small group, voted into place, and their findings and decisions respected and implemented, without arguments.

[Jon Fuller]

Originally Posted by PKJB

Would the MSA (Motor Sports Association) be a possible way forward, they already have the infrastructure in place to support most requirements. A combination of their infrastructure and the knowledge that exists within the current clubs would create a "driving" (pun) force for improvement.

Is there any ruling to say that they couldn't be affiliated to both the FIA and UIM ?

I don't know the answer to that.

How are they funded? and I wonder how many licence holding members they have to fund it, if thats where it comes from

[motorvator]

Originally Posted by Jon Fuller

To be perfectly honest, I think asking teams, or builders, or suppliers to sit on a committee would be disasterous, or as Barrie Williams would say, a mad womans breakfast.

You'd end up with 30 odd 'Fabio Buzzi's' each arguing why they should be allowed to run this engine, or that drive, or make this mod. would be ferkin crazy. the decision makers need to be a small group, voted into place, and their findings and decisions respected and implemented, without arguments.

You're right the individuals cannot sit at committee but surely the owners / drivers should vote or at least voice who that committee is? At the moment from an outside observation it appears that the collective is seeing stuff appear from nowhere with no previous consultation.

It's that lack of democracy that leaves all the running down of individuals who to be fair are doing their bit to get the racing approved. Would the RYA / UIM / Whoever genuinely turn round to a proposition from the racers themselves and say clear off it's nothing to do with you?

Oh and how brave are you? Referring to Sheena as mad indeed

[Tony Davis]

Originally Posted by PKJB

Would the MSA (Motor Sports Association) be a possible way forward, they already have the infrastructure in place to support most requirements.

Do you really think they would be interested in what would be to them a minority sport?

[PKJB]

Originally Posted by Jon Fuller

I don't know the answer to that.

How are they funded? and I wonder how many licence holding members they have to fund it, if thats where it comes from

From the 2009 accounts the MSA have 33,000 licence holders.....if we were to look at this route then at least we would have access to all the admin facilities and insurance at reasonable costs (reduced licence costs ?) and our small numbers would not cause any issues to their systems and processes.

Agree with all the sentiments of a ruling council specific for powerboat racing that would need voting on but from an organisational sense we would also need access to many elements that include legal, insurance, licences, safety etc all of which the MSA could provide hopefully with the required economies of scale.

The MSA would also provide that element of recognition that is helpful to other organisations (MCA, Coastguard etc).

Just a thought but having looked at the option of breaking away many years ago when OCR was running fleets of 35 boats at all events and had a healthy basic series as well when you start to delve into the detail the "structure" you require becomes quite difficult to replicate without a great deal of money.

[PKJB]

Originally Posted by Tony Davis

Do you really think they would be interested in what would be to them a minority sport?

In truth I have no idea but most petrol heads seem to like fast boats as well as fast cars and the UIM affiliation could open up the possibility of some interesting events !

[Jon Fuller]

Originally Posted by motorvator

You're right the individuals cannot sit at committee but surely the owners / drivers should vote or at least voice who that committee is?

I agree the committee members should be voted on. It's hard to say who they should be voted on by though. Foe example, if the guys racing OCR were to collectively and deliberately choose, and vote into place someone they could control at committee level, the people 'effectively' in control might not necessarily be the right people.

[Mike Lloyd]

It was also a huge mistake to take these rules to the UIM, as that meant not only handing over power to them, but leaving representation (of the UK interest & the class in general) to 'others'. As I say, a massively naive move. Mike and I are literally kicking ourselves for that. *Quote John Fuller*

This all makes for fascinating reading, Gary Manchester has depressed me totally saying no none over 65 should be contributing to making decisions on the ORC so that's me finished, (luckily I retired from the ORC last week so that's O.K. then).

Re Johns comment, I have to hold my hands up to causing this whole problem of the UIM getting involved. My excuse, if you can call it that, is that in all innocence I initially (with the agreement of the BPRC) wanted the 50th anniversary of the CTC race to be a world class event and so making the two races much more attractive and interesting to potential international competitors - hence the UIM getting involved.

In retrospect, one of those stupid mistakes that one makes sometimes by not thinking the problem through thoroughly before making the request to the RYA.

With regard to this thread and the suggestions for a breakaway organistation, be careful here, last year Lord Beaverbrook launched FORCE (Federation Of Racing Clubs - don't ask about the E!), which was to be an organisation for all of the clubs to be a part of and to be a united force when talking to the RYA. JP nearly blew a gaskit at the following ORC meeting suggesting that it had been set up to undermine the RYA! As if. Unfortunately it never went any further because Lord Beaverbrook went on to do other things and it wasn't followed through. Pretty interesting reaction from JP though as those who were at that particular ORC meeting will confirm.
However, I can now simply concentrate on the taking part which is just sooooooo much less stressful!
ML.
.

[Jon Fuller]

Originally Posted by OldMan

In retrospect, one of those stupid mistakes that one makes sometimes by not thinking the problem through thoroughly before making the request to the RYA.

ML.
.

Shame JP didn't warn us of this prior to requesting UIM status. He did say to me 'afterwards', I'm surprised you wanted to do that!

Some advice would have been very useful.

Mike, it was only your idea. Everyone else agreed and aided pushing it fwd, me included, thinking it had to be a good thing, so blame for the naivety is collective.

[DAVE]

Originally Posted by Jon Fuller

Shame JP didn't warn us of this prior to requesting UIM status. He did say to me 'afterwards', I'm surprised you wanted to do that!

Some advice would have been very useful.

Mike, it was only your idea. Everyone else agreed and aided pushing it fwd, me included, thinking it had to be a good thing, so blame for the naivety is collective.

Nice try.....clearly Jon's fault......

[OCRDA]

Would the RYA / UIM / Whoever genuinely turn round to a proposition from the racers themselves and say clear off it's nothing to do with you?

YES !!

[OCRDA]

Jon & Paul I sent you both a PM earlier !!

Bob

[flightracingteam]

[

This all makes for fascinating reading, Gary Manchester has depressed me totally saying no none over 65 should be contributing to making decisions on the ORC so that's me finished, (luckily I retired from the ORC last week so that's O.K. then).

Sorry Mike it was not you i was geting at you dont look 65

[Jon Fuller]

Originally Posted by OCRDA

Jon & Paul I sent you both a PM earlier !!

Bob

Moi??

didn't get it!

j

[Captain Chaos]

Originally Posted by OldMan

I can now simply concentrate on the taking part which is just sooooooo much less stressful!.

thats exactly what I'm finding

[Renegade]

Originally Posted by OldMan

It was also a huge mistake to take these rules to the UIM, as that meant not only handing over power to them, but leaving representation (of the UK interest & the class in general) to 'others'. As I say, a massively naive move. Mike and I are literally kicking ourselves for that. *Quote John Fuller*

This all makes for fascinating reading, Gary Manchester has depressed me totally saying no none over 65 should be contributing to making decisions on the ORC so that's me finished, (luckily I retired from the ORC last week so that's O.K. then).

Re Johns comment, I have to hold my hands up to causing this whole problem of the UIM getting involved. My excuse, if you can call it that, is that in all innocence I initially (with the agreement of the BPRC) wanted the 50th anniversary of the CTC race to be a world class event and so making the two races much more attractive and interesting to potential international competitors - hence the UIM getting involved.

In retrospect, one of those stupid mistakes that one makes sometimes by not thinking the problem through thoroughly before making the request to the RYA.

With regard to this thread and the suggestions for a breakaway organistation, be careful here, last year Lord Beaverbrook launched FORCE (Federation Of Racing Clubs - don't ask about the E!), which was to be an organisation for all of the clubs to be a part of and to be a united force when talking to the RYA. JP nearly blew a gaskit at the following ORC meeting suggesting that it had been set up to undermine the RYA! As if. Unfortunately it never went any further because Lord Beaverbrook went on to do other things and it wasn't followed through. Pretty interesting reaction from JP though as those who were at that particular ORC meeting will confirm.
However, I can now simply concentrate on the taking part which is just sooooooo much less stressful!
ML.
.

The last I heard Mike, it was not Illegal to be part of a UNION! ooh errh! bit of politics...mrs thatch etc!

[Ciao]

To get this thread back on track -

I am pleased to announce that the BPRC is very close to finalising the funding for the 2010 British Powerboat Festival.

Safety Boats will have free berthing in Cowes from Wednesday 11.00 am though to Monday 11.00 am

Safety Boat crew ( x 5) will enjoy the various social functions from Wednesday though to Sunday at no charge.

All Safety Boat crew will be given a memento to celebrate their help.

We have kept entry fees for competitors as low as possible for this Event.

Your entry fees will account to 20 % of the budget of running this event.

As always, I look forward to taking your phone calls - Forms for download are here >> http://cowes2010.co.uk/competitors.htm

[Captain Chaos]

Seems things are moving forward John, which is excellent news. Are all of the people that have informed you of thier intention to race paid up and ready to go?

I think the safety crews being given propper treatment is great to see and I'm sure they'll all enjoy a momento.

If 20% is covering the costs of the event, may I ask (probably a nieve) question.... whats the other 80% do?

[Ciao]

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